Do We Have Cherry Picker's ?

[montecarlo]

I recently made me a Terran Scout and I love playing him in the game, and i like to pick the hulks alot
and I use to find some pretty nice stuff, but here lately most of what i find is debris and wreckage slag,
some times I get lucky and find a gene-map or a space suit and quite a bit of useless ores and even more useless proto stuff, what happen'd to the every once in awhile Black Force 8 or 9 I use to find ?
and the devices that we're in them. Is this punishment to the cherry picker's ? if so then why punish all ? I say catch them and lock their accounts or ban the IP addy, of course this could be part of the Beta
I suppose.

[Terrell [BT]]

There are cherry pickers to some degree, that will likely always be the case and it's not against the rules to do so. Some explorers think that cherry picking is not good etiquette but not all explorers agree and they're free to disagree. Prospectables that are cherry picked, should despawn after a certain amount of time. There are also bonuses for emptying any prospectable, as well as field clear bonuses to encourage explorers to strip mine. Hulk fields may also be on longer timers than orefields.

[snowy]

So if I need 5 noxion I should clear a whole field in Glenn? There's no way of telling where one field ends and the other begins. As for hulk fields.. There was no such thing in live and they should be done away with. In live it was a rare thing to find a hulk, they weren't necessarily in ore fields either, just the odd one here and there and even then there was only a slim chance of finding something good in there.

If the field respawn rates were calculated on an "x" minutes since last item mined from field then if someone did cherry pick then the field might respawn soon afterwards if it were no longer being mined. The possibility of people taking what they want and then waiting for respawn could be countered somewhat by making duration "x" a variable that might perhaps be anything from 10mins - a hour or so.

[Mynd [BT]]

No..you don't have to clear the whole field if you are only looking for a specific resource. As for Glenn, I have gotten the "field clear bonus" whenever I chose to strip mine the fields, and I never had a problem being unable to ascertain where one field ended and another began in Glenn.

In regard to the hulk fields, there is nothing wrong with them (other than the tables being adjusted somewhat) and should remain in game. While the original "Live" game aspects does indeed remain a good template for the Emu here.... "Live however, is not the absolute Gospel." as was eloquently stated by one of the devs, and I agree with this.

montecarlo, if you want GoBB drops, then you will have to get them from the GoBB raid. It does not make sense for these items to be in hulks.

Cherry picking...wow, how hard is it to simply remove every item in a hulk/asteroid being mined and simply spacing what one does not want or need? Even still, locking and banning IP addresses over this is extreme form of punishment...and a bad idea.

About the only thing you can do is shout "[insert name here], STOP CHERRY PICKING THESE HULKS/ROIDS!!!!" in market, general, or broadcast chat if you catch the individual(s) doing it. With my smart-alec @$$, if I saw this, I would more than likely message the individual and be like "Dude...are you cherry-picking? O_o".......lmao.

[montecarlo]

Well guys thanks for the info, and from that and a TV show you gave me a great idea !! ( evil grin )

[GenghisBob]

There is no such thing as 'cherry picking'. Take what you want and stop whinning. Shout all you want. But if you're not shouting in my guild chat I won't have the skightest idea what you say, or that you are saying anything.

ps. I'm not an explorer so I can't cherry pick. Edited September 19, 2012 by GenghisBob

[drjeff]

Its another one of those grey areas of game play....
A). Missions might demand a certain ore, so you go out to a likely field, scan each ore in the field till you see the ore you need and go mine it...rinse and repeat till you got the ores you need and leave. -->>Perfectly normal game play.
. Collecting specific ores for components for a weapon or a device, etc...once again scanning ore fields for the ones you need....mine them and leave. -->> perfectly normal game play.
C). Clearing everything in an ore field for fun and profit, plus the bonus xp from clearing the field. -->> perfectly normal game play.
D). Cherry picking only the ores you want from asteroids and leaving the rest in each asteroid. --> still legal game play, but being an asshole.
E). Cherry picking all the lvl 9 asteroids in a field and leaving all the rest. --->>> legal..is this being an asshole or a semi-asshole?

Unfortunately, the solution to some problems cannot be legislated away...like being thoughtful of how your actions are effecting other players. Some things require maturity and awareness and being thoughtful and kind to those around you. You cant pass a law against being an asshole.







[color=#ee82ee][size=5][font=comic sans ms', cursive]RIANA[/font][/size][/color] Edited September 20, 2012 by drjeff

[Stanig[IS]]

Lets take a look at this from a real life perspective.

When a company, individual, government starts a mining/drilling operation... what do they go after?

The yielding ore, gas, oil, etc... and the rocks get left behind. Now those rocks may contain other useful mineral deposits, but the operation is not interested in them.

They take the coal/oil and leave the rest behind.

That is pretty much how it works here.

However at least here things will respawn. Consider that a good side

[Pyryck]

I'm really offended by the indescriminate derogatory name calling towards miners as a whole. It's totally uncalled for.

Especially from some players that have absolutely no problem whatsoever cherry picking only the job terminal missions that they want.

Or from some player that has absolutely no problem whatsoever cherry picking only a named mob and ignoring everything else around it.

If you want to fix the cherry picking problem then shut the emu down, because the entirety of the game play found is based on cherry picking the parts of the content that you want to enjoy.

[cpwings]

If you are mining for the exploration XP you will want to empty all roids for the bonus. This is important to low to mid level miners and is also a great way to make credits.

If you are a high level or maxed player you may not be concerned about the field clear bonus and are only interested in ores you need for an alt perhaps.
Leaving behind anything else will still leave the field clear bonus for someone else.

There are very few hulk fields and they are picked over daily. The high level hulk fields I've seen are well guarded. Taking time to empty them of lvl1 debris or lvl2 slag while trying to avoid being killed is pointless IMO.

Remove the low-level junk from high-level hulks and quicken the respawn. Maybe less hulks per field but more fields spread to more sectors would level the playing field.

[Mynd [BT]]

The only high level mobs (guarding a hulk field) that pose a risk/threat to my JE are the minions at the GoBB spawn point. Even then, if you are careful and know what you are doing, it is possible to mine those hulk right under there noses....as a JE of course. Other than that, I don't worry about any of the other types of high level field guardians because they can't kill my JE.

However, the point made about the low level debris/slag in high level hulks is a good one. Either remove them or up the level on the ones that appear in the higher level hulks....make them worthwhile (xp and credit-wise) to mine.

[Terrell [BT]]

Have to agree about L1 and L2 slag & debris, in hulks higher than L3. That shouldn't be there, instead there should be "junk loot" of a level within 1 level of the hulk in question in smaller quantities in lieu of slag/debris. Doing a field clear job when the field is hulks, or clearing hulk fields in general, often results in stacks of slag or debris, as some of the hulks have rather large amounts of the stuff. While a stack of slag or debris does give credits when vendored, for most mid level or higher explorers it doesn't offer any trade XP.

[montecarlo]

I was talking about HULKS, I could care less about ROID's, But I found a cure for it so as far as I'm concern'd this is a closed topic.

( evil grin )

[Mattsacre]

About the low level slag debis:
What is a hulk suppost to represent? The remains of some unfortunate warrior/trader/explorer's ship, sometimes a ship would be so shot up and fraged that there would remain little or no real remains of value...i.e. ferrous "slag" and constituent alloys. So no, really there should be still low level debris and slag.

Sometimes occasionally the ship wouldn't be so fragged and there might be some of the former owners cargo on board, they may have jettisoned it before Kaboom, or it survived the shoot em up, be it ammo, trade goods or ore. For the later ore, the unrefined ore occurance should far outway the refined, since the explorer would have been mining or transporting raw not refined.

Sometimes (even rarer), actual gear would survive, this should be spread evenly over the gear spectrum and should be at or 1 level lower then the hulk itself, (maybe the lost soul got got their ticket punched from inferiour gear).

About the hulf field vs. singular occurance:
Whats more likely? Lots and lots of crumpled up ships or a few hulled ships per area? A "field" of hulks should have some clearly defined "reason" for all the hulks, I.E GoBB or Boss type guardian is killing of brave souls, it should also have a higher occurance rate of "good stuff" there, it isn't L10 players risking their ships on bosses after all its well geared ships.

This is not to say hulk fields all must have a killer about, but some other occurance shoould be about, like a singularity field, hulks from point X are being sucked in and being spewed out on the other side at point Y, with a singularity about it would have various grav shears etc.

Like live, there should be wide scatter, low occurance hulks in various ore fields, THAT would be indicitive of the singular W/T/E getting popped by a mob/ore guardian/pop rock etc.

All the hulks should have a fail rate on them, not every hulk is "stable" perhaps they had unseen unstables, perhaps by mining them the tenious balance of the hull finaly gives in. A few of the hulks when failing should have poprock effects, Kaboomers etc., when extracting a pile of something in the hulk there should be a ever increasing chance of the hulk despawning, you get x amount of ore etc. and the hulk finally gives in and the remaining goods are destroyed.

About the cherry picking: not everything had something good in it and someone premined it from you. Unless you actually see them pulling from a hulk and then moving on then you can't know can you. And even if you see them do it...(I hate cherry pickers) get over it..its a legit thing even if annoying.

Instituting some "punishement" for cherrypickers is plain stupid, it's trying to legislate stupid, peeps have the right to be dumb! If you saw someone buy a 2 liter cola, drink 1 liter, then discard the rest (better be in a trashcan 'tard! ) Would you be up in arms? Yes it was wasteful, but it was theirs to waste, they paid for it, enjoyed of it what they wished, then discarded what they no longer wanted.

[Reon]

I have gotten into friendly banter about this many times. I personally have no issue with someone going after ambrosia crude clearing out only hydrocarbon deposits, or only clearing out just the hydrocarbon deposits with the item they want in them, but someone taking only the rare ores is annoying. It is less of an issue in this emu just because the population numbers are lower, less people cherry pick, and most people are like me and will clear out a picked asteroid just to get the thing to despawn or get the cleared bonus.

No matter what I or anyone else thinks, people will still do it. I reserve the right to roll my eyes at the people who complain that the extra couple seconds can not be spent to clear out what they started to mine.

As far as wreckage slag in the high level hulks...leave it there. Honestly...a ship, regardless of what level of weapons it has....will still have unusable debris when it is blown to oblivion. That being said, you can please both sides of the crowd by simply changing the number of debris to be found in higher level hulks. Make the numbers like 2 or 3 wreckage slag or debris rather than a stack of 40. This will remove the concerns about debris being useless(because it will become more rare and valuable), it will keep players inventories from becoming crowded with it, and because it will only take a second to mine, it will remove the "the mobs are too tough and i can't mine the debris without getting killed" argument.

Those are my thoughts...and at the end of the day, it doesn't really matter...haters going to hate...cherrypickers going to leave crap for everyone else.

[montecarlo]

OK, I don't have a problem with someone just taking 1 ore deposit from a ore field, and as I thought about it some more cherry pick away, and plz leave the debris a slag in them, It's still going to get you cash when you turn it in, which will be nice when we go live.
And as I said before this matter is closed.

[Terrell [BT]]

On the issue of debris/wreckage slag, there's an easy solution that solves all the problems involved. Have more levels of what amounts to scrap metal. Say have L4 smashed metal, L6 melted debris, and L8 twisted metal. Perhaps some of it could even be used, at a later date, as a component in something. Likely something of Bogeril design.

[GenghisBob]

If a hulk has only level 1 or 2 debris in it, how can you possibly call it a level 8 or 9 hulk?

Now sometimes someone may have removed some higher level items, which is fine, but if it spawned with only low level sutff, please don't call it a level 9 hulk.

[Mynd [BT]]

I made the suggestion that the debris/slag found in high level hulks be should comparative in level or value credit-wise to serve as an enticement for would-be cherry pickers to spend those few extra seconds emptying the hulk(s) of their contents.

Looking at the big picture...you want the hulks to respawn (we must remember that hulk fields are on timers), but at the same time nobody wants to "clean up" after someone else. Well, I know I don't as I am nobody's maid, and I know I'm not the only one that feels this way. On more occasions than I care to count, I have visited those hulk fields in Glory's Orbit for example, only to find debris or the other worthless items like the shield array in 95% of the hulks out there.

I could see if it was 1 or 2 hulks like that, but that is utterly ridiculous lol....ah well.

[Spa[IS]]

Have you cashed in the wreckage and slag and actually checked the credits and xp you get for them? I have and I loot them and cash them in. you very easly get 300 stacks quickly and they sell for a pretty penny

I know a lot of the hulks just contain the so called junk players do not want to pick, but by looting them all, the next spawn seems to have better loot in them (from what I have tested)

[Mynd [BT]]

[quote name='Spa' timestamp='1348462085' post='63657']
Have you cashed in the wreckage and slag and actually checked the credits and xp you get for them? I have and I loot them and cash them in. you very easly get 300 stacks quickly and they sell for a pretty penny

I know a lot of the hulks just contain the so called junk players do not want to pick, but by looting them all, the next spawn seems to have better loot in them (from what I have tested)
[/quote]

I think it is about 50k a stack...which is a decent sum of money for a lowbie as well as xp. As a 150+ explorer you get no xp...and 50k is chump change for a high level player.

True that in regard to better items in the next resulting spawn providing you are around when it does re-spawn. Still you have to hope and pray that the cherry picker doesn't get there first lol.

[montecarlo]

I get 70.500 and i dtill have a peg to fill in that department on slag and debris .

[Terrell [BT]]

[quote name='Spa' timestamp='1348462085' post='63657']
Have you cashed in the wreckage and slag and actually checked the credits and xp you get for them? I have and I loot them and cash them in. you very easly get 300 stacks quickly and they sell for a pretty penny

I know a lot of the hulks just contain the so called junk players do not want to pick, but by looting them all, the next spawn seems to have better loot in them (from what I have tested)
[/quote]

My PE Toria might still get XP for mining/selling wreckage slag, and debris, but that's because she's my smallest explorer at OL23. On Terence (C16, E45, T49) Torrie (C25, E44, T50), or Terrell (150+) I can forget about trade or explore XP for L1-L2 items. Their TL and EL are too high to get anything other than the roid cleared/field cleared bonus and some credits. IMO the best solution is to replace debris/slag in higher level hulks with new variants of scrap metal of apropriate level to the hulk. The same graphic could be used for the new types of scrap metal, the level would be different so that XP could be obtained by higher level explorers clearing the hulks. Just pick the lowest level that a person with E50/T50 can mine and sell and still get XP for as the highest level for scrap metal, maybe add one.

[Falstar [MOD]]

Matt & Reon said it well - ships don't get destroyed and leave perfectly functioning items all the time. The idea is to have a hulk - a shell of a ship - scrap - that *may* have salvageable items. I could see arguments for more levels of debris (say some hulls are made of slightly move valuable material) but in the end, the whole point is to go through wrecks and salvage, which could be a chance of getting nothing 'good'.

Back to Cherrypicking - there are many threads about this, so hopefully this won't turn into another. I'll provide links to others if needed, but I think the topic has been discussed pretty well over time.

[rhobix]

[quote name='Dakynos' timestamp='1348536752' post='63697']
Matt & Reon said it well - ships don't get destroyed and leave perfectly functioning items all the time. The idea is to have a hulk - a shell of a ship - scrap - that *may* have salvageable items. I could see arguments for more levels of debris (say some hulls are made of slightly move valuable material) but in the end, the whole point is to go through wrecks and salvage, which could be a chance of getting nothing 'good'.

Back to Cherrypicking - there are many threads about this, so hopefully this won't turn into another. I'll provide links to others if needed, but I think the topic has been discussed pretty well over time.
[/quote]
This point of view just gave me an idea. What if the goodies (or some of them) in hulks didn't show up until you've picked through (prospected) the debris and wreckage slag (or some of it)?