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Ryle

The Combat Cloak Problem

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Yes, its Bleak, if theres any dev or anyone that wants to accompany I will happily show them how I do it. In spite of what I've been up to, surprisingly I am in favor of harder content! Lol


Its all good bro, It had to stop sometime I guess. Its not even like I need to solo it lol, our guild as it is can take GoBB/Troller not to mention Fishbowl with great ease.

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[quote name='Drained' timestamp='1339381415' post='58676']
Its all good bro, It had to stop sometime I guess. Its not even like I need to solo it lol, our guild as it is can take GoBB/Troller not to mention Fishbowl with great ease.
[/quote]

Except when the server crashed on precursor alpha XD

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Awwww that was painful man..... lol Not the first time thats happened.

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We are all going to log in and die :(

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PFFFT I'm gonna cloak right away lol

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I have seen JD's cloak so fast that I never even see there name... I don't know for certainty that what I see and what's really going on are the same. Though I am sure that it's faster than three seconds I really don't know. I too don't like what the JD has been capable of doing. Just like being able to pull a mob 250k away by having 2 JD's in group and double summoning.

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[quote name='Ryle' timestamp='1339380968' post='58669']
martyrs heart

by all means please give me an instant refill shields button usable every 45 seconds in between saps.
[/quote]

OhOH..touche! :)

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[quote name='Drained' timestamp='1339381797' post='58680']
PFFFT I'm gonna cloak right away lol
[/quote]

And here we are back to this thread. -.-

Its not cloaking that bothers me, its the invulnerability and speed of it where you can pretty much avoid all damage and still dish it to a mob, no matter what it is. Everything dies, even raid ones.

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So we agree that NOT nerfing the JD (as many Progens on these forums usually advocate) but to unnerf your PW? Or to fix the MOB AI? I am in full agreement. :lol:
Yah let's please get off this soapbox of nerfing other classes because yours doesn't do what you would like it too. I think your post would have been better served if you had suggested they unnerfed your PW instead.

I do not play any progens what so ever. All jenquai all the time. ;) So you will never see me go after a PW because they have a huge hull and can take on a group of mobs at once, something a JD can not do. They are totally different classes even tho they are both warriors. Play style is different, skills are different, everything is different. I am more apt to whine about my summon distance sucking because I cant summon or fold far enough away to isolate a mob. It usually take a couple summons to break its tethering.
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Just to put my 2 quatloos in.

I play a TS as my main, consistently, even from very early levels (like CL 5), I've been able to kite things well over 10 levels above me with a minimum of effort.

No special abilities, no powers, just a matter of engine speed and the range on missile launchers. Things that could erase me in 10 seconds, I keep in a range where I can take my sweet time killing them. granted, it often takes me up of 10 minutes per mob to do so.

As such, should missile launchers be range nerfed? should terran numbers for speed be nerfed? more importantly, will I be able to do this same thing at raid levels? I'm genuinely curious here, as it does seriously feel that my TS at CL 5 was far more capable than my PW at comparable CL.

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Currently the way the Emu is the JD can take on a group of mobs at once, hence being able to solo the FB... Which the PW can not, and never was able to.

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[quote name='Algaron' timestamp='1339382237' post='58686']
So we agree that NOT nerfing the JD (as many Progens on these forums usually advocate) but to unnerf your PW? Or to fix the MOB AI? I am in full agreement. :lol:
Yah let's please get off this soapbox of nerfing other classes because yours doesn't do what you would like it too. I think your post would have been better served if you had suggested they unnerfed your PW instead.

I do not play any progens what so ever. All jenquai all the time. ;) So you will never see me go after a PW because they have a huge hull and can take on a group of mobs at once, something a JD can not do. They are totally different classes even tho they are both warriors. Play style is different, skills are different, everything is different. I am more apt to whine about my summon distance sucking because I cant summon or fold far enough away to isolate a mob. It usually take a couple summons to break its tethering.
[/quote]

Just to be clear on one thing here. When you are talking about a raid class mob, level 66, it doesnt matter if you have HDC and a 82k hull, they kill you plenty fast. Theres no reason it should be any different for a JD. Sure cloak, but there should be a very real risk of either that cloak failing you for being a derp trying to solo a cl66 mob, or the mob seeing right through it and one shotting you just like they would Ryle. (you should see what happens when BM is doing the bowl and im tanking and Rich, our TT, crashes. I live about 20 seconds then)

Thats what I am getting at. Edited by Ryle

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[quote name='Sleven.' timestamp='1339381954' post='58683']
I have seen JD's cloak so fast that I never even see there name... I don't know for certainty that what I see and what's really going on are the same. Though I am sure that it's faster than three seconds I really don't know. I too don't like what the JD has been capable of doing. Just like being able to pull a mob 250k away by having 2 JD's in group and double summoning.
[/quote]
Most of that is attributable to latency, they hit a button and it processes the packets, they are under wraps of cloak befoer it processes your seeing them packets.

The 2x summon thing is actually a "outside the box" thinking on peoples part, that I'm sure will be addressed at some point. If people aren't using it to get "undue advantages" on other players (and remember its alpha, you are suppost to be thinking outside the box and reporting what and how you did it) then it isn't a priority "exploit" squash thing, but if they have reported the ability to do it (as they should) be confident it will go on the ever long "honeydew" list.

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Agreed. The speed of cloaking is the problem right now. Nothing else. Even super fast cloaking will not let you escape damage right now - just mitigates it a bit. But there lots of cloaking issues. Group cloak isn't working correctly at the moment. Scan is broken. My JD's (and PWs of course) crit targeting is broken or turned off.

And the double summoning is NOT an exploit. It is a skill and technique that is working as it should.

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[quote name='muse' timestamp='1339382248' post='58687']
Just to put my 2 quatloos in.

I play a TS as my main, consistently, even from very early levels (like CL 5), I've been able to kite things well over 10 levels above me with a minimum of effort.

No special abilities, no powers, just a matter of engine speed and the range on missile launchers. Things that could erase me in 10 seconds, I keep in a range where I can take my sweet time killing them. granted, it often takes me up of 10 minutes per mob to do so.

As such, should missile launchers be range nerfed? should terran numbers for speed be nerfed? more importantly, will I be able to do this same thing at raid levels? I'm genuinely curious here, as it does seriously feel that my TS at CL 5 was far more capable than my PW at comparable CL.
[/quote]
Thats been addressed by giving mobs like GoBB range well beyond any ML...

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[quote name='Algaron' timestamp='1339382616' post='58691']
Agreed. The speed of cloaking is the problem right now. Nothing else. Even super fast cloaking will not let you escape damage right now - just mitigates it a bit. But there lots of cloaking issues. Group cloak isn't working correctly at the moment. Scan is broken. My JD's (and PWs of course) crit targeting is broken or turned off.

And the double summoning is NOT an exploit. It is a skill and technique that is working as it should.
[/quote]
Is that how it was in live? JD's being able to pull raid mobs up to 250k from there spawn point? Because everyone I have asked said that wasn't possible. Makes me wonder, why?

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I was told that mobs like GoBB, at least if it was in live, and other cl 66's the chain summoning and summoning in general would fail constantly, it had a lower success rate than with say cl 50 mobs. But if it worked, then yeah, you'd get a mob 250k away from the nav point.

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No. You can not pull a mob from 250k away, not in live and not in EMU.

The maximum summon range for mobs is 6.5k without a buff. The thing they were talking about is double summoning, where another JD summons YOU from 200k away while you are summoning a mob. Its take a certain amount of skill to do this as well.

I have said it before and will say it again. JD's are for professional players. Everyone else plays a progen. :P

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Mixing up people Algeron, im ninjette, that was Sleven =]

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Im kinda scared to level Ninjette to 150 actually. The only thing keeping me from soloing everything now as it is is the fact it would take forever due to level 7 weapons. I already have the cloak and avoid damage skill down, and a martyrs heart.

But I digress, Bleak offered to show you guys how its done so Ill leave it up to him to illustrate how this is a problem or severe balance issue. Edited by Ryle

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[quote name='Algaron' timestamp='1339383520' post='58698']
No. You can not pull a mob from 250k away, not in live and not in EMU.

The maximum summon range for mobs is 6.5k without a buff. The thing they were talking about is double summoning, where another JD summons YOU from 200k away while you are summoning a mob. Its take a certain amount of skill to do this as well.

I have said it before and will say it again. JD's are for professional players. Everyone else plays a progen. :P
[/quote]
That is what I meant... That is what I stated earlier in the thread I didn't think I'd have to reiterate it. It's not that difficult to do it, i have tried it several times myself just to see how easy it was. Just takes a little practice.

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2x summon, yes and no, it's not working as intended. It was doable live, but there was a cooldown period (sort of) JD 1 had to suffer the slings and arrows of the pissed mob for a time before the JD 2's summon took effect, there wasn't chain summoning, there was a "take effect" time built in.

Keep in mind as well, /resistance of skills/, mobs had resistances to things and summon wasn't a sure thing, you tried and failed it still was aggroed on you, and all the mobs around the failed attemptee was now pissed at you as well. The boss mobs were near impregnable to summons, let alone 2x times.

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I would never say take the nerf bat to the JD because I don't like particular things that are going on in the game... I just hope at some point that "balance" happens. I know I definitely didn't like it when they beat the PW with it.

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[quote name='Sleven.' timestamp='1339385237' post='58706']
I would never say take the nerf bat to the JD because I don't like particular things that are going on in the game... I just hope at some point that "balance" happens. I know I definitely didn't like it when they beat the PW with it.
[/quote]

As a player who has played a PW since the first month of Live as a main... i couldnt agree more. Why nerf my profession doing what it does best? Its not like I can go mine some roids or even build many things... yea sure weapons, but cant even make them for 1/3 of the playerbase, jen weaps are restricted. So what do I do? Take a backseat to a hybrid class while they take away what the whole point of mine was? All because of the unneeded nerf?

I mean I wont even get into the DPS bull they are pulling now either. Really, six guns, combat trance and 70 percent native cloak and im getting out DPSed by something with one less weapon and no trance, all because they get this silly double damage coming out of cloak?

Talk about having your cake and eating it too. Edited by Ryle

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