EnB needs some changes - endgame suffering

[GMan33]

Hello,

First of all, i wanna say thanks, thanks, thanks for all the devs and others who have gotten EnB back in a playable state so we can all enjoy it.

Im a huge EnB fan, loved it from day 1 when it launched years ago, and it was and still is my favorite mmo of all time. Of course getting into the emulator and finally playing again.....cant tell you how excited i was. I brought in many friends, including real life buddies, who all, like me, were of the most hardcore enb players. If people would stop playing enb...we would be the last ones....


But....

Sadly im seeing a downward trend in EnB. People are leaving. These are your hardcore, most dedicated EnB players, who basically run the builds, run the markets, run the raids....and they are leaving.....I see it first hand, I see it in my friends list...they are leaving.

Now before you chime in, I know most will say, dont worry, more content is coming. Great! But thats not the problem. Thats not what kept us playing day in and day out back in EA Live, even though we ate through ALL the content. What was it?

1. Community
2. Constant Raids
3. Always better items to shoot for.

Let me tackle the community first. Of course we all love enb, we wouldnt be here if we didnt. So you would think, thats a given. But its not. Obviously the first problem is, there is simply not enough of us. Averaging about 200 players online is....well...its pretty damn low. Over 1k average and then its getting closer to how a regular enb server might have been. So how do you get more people? The biggest thing is word of mouth. If the game is great, people are having fun, and we see more friends coming, its spreads like wildfire....but the opposite is happening. The reason people are leaving....well its because its not exactly how it was in EA live. Let me explain...

1. Tada Gate Raid - We all remember this? We all remember how, exciting it was to get to your first tada raid, and perhaps see other fellow pilots you talk to in market, or you grouped with before. Yeah, many would come from all sorts of guilds. It created a very interesting and fun event that got the server always involved - together.
But now you created one big problem - you made it a triggered raid. First of all, Tada was never a triggered raid. It always a timed based one. What did this do? It allowed anyone who was able to fight, and was able to be on time, to do tada whenever they pleased. It created a great entertainment during the week a few times, that you knew was coming. You knew at X time, Tada will be up, get your buddies out and lets go have fun! People who had no chance of ever gettin raid gear, suddenly found themselves in being in either an auction or a lotto system to get gear! It created fun, it created drama, most important, it created memories. So what do we have now?
Well, now we have this torturing task of trying to obtain feathers, and then on top putting all the other parts together in order to make one triggered device to run tada one time. Heres the problem.....we dont have 10k people playing this game, where there are many people out there making devices, and hence, creating raids, all the time. Were average 200 people online. Anyone who was hardcore into making tada raids, has either got all the gear and is done, and or has quit. Why? Because its really tedious to keep created fishmasters over and over and over again for Tado ----- But for FB its ok...thats how it was in Live and thats how it should be, plus it was a higher tier raid, which warranted more effort to do it.
But because its triggered it usually is guild only, so now it alienates the whole server into sections which in turn, hurts community and goes against one aspect that build EnB community in EA Live.

So this could of lead to constant weekly raids...Tada was the buffer until you could do the bigger/harder raids. Of course now we have some, but not all raids we had from EA Live are in....more are pending to come sometime in the future.

SOLUTION - Tada becomes timed based like it was in EA Live - Triggers remain for Fishbowl

2. Loot Tables - For some reason this is another problem thats still on going. There has been tweaks here, tweaks there. Our latest plague is Controller. Lets be honest, most people who raid him will say he drops crap...and thats true. We have killed him several times in the spam of 2 months...not....one...core. And most of the time he just drops 1 item. I mean cmon now....we want things to be challenging but not downright fustrating. Yeah devs tell us numbers are right....are they? I dont know. The loot tables on tada/fb were down right fustrating, just fustrating.
Now i heard, but dont remember that GOBB at one point, their weapons turbo equipped stacked with tada/fb. Obviously not the case anymore, but, you potentially had an extremely desirable, hard raid, that had all enb raiders, hardcores, vets, going buck wild crazy....for a chance for some really, really exciting loot. Now wether for game balance, or other reasons it was pulled. Whats left is really a side upgrade, nothing to exciting. But heres an example to think....ok, what can we do too really get people excited to do this. Maybe it wasnt 40% turbo stack, what about just 10% turbo equip stack? You know something unique, which can only be obtained from GOBB. I mean without specifics, think as a player, what the hell would make me drool over this...what would make me want to pursue this for x months at a chance getting?

SOLUTION - Further get loot tables to how they were in live - its getting there, but its not there yet...but keep it up, i know your working on it, and its very, very important. And spice up the loot where you can, get raiders excited! Dont hold back.

3. AA devices - Ok...these...are the most elite...rare...mythical items that was in EnB. I mean when we say rare...we mean rare. What did this create? It created the sense that no matter how much raid you did, how much gear you got....there was always that chance, that maybe, just maybe you might land an AA one day in your inventory. This created extreme excitement for ones who got one, and extreme jealousy for everyone else wishing to one day get one. But that hope, that chance to have one, was always there, as part of the drive among other things to keep going.
Just to clarify, not only were they extremely rare to get...you also had the chance that it will fail to be analyzed at station, and you get nothing.
What do we have now? You make them drop like flies. You go from random analyze to 100% turn in. You completely destroyed their value to where they are no more important then player made items. You have flooded the playerbase with so many AAs that some have vaults filled with AAs and not know what to do with them. I mean when you can go out, and in couple hours grab yourself 4 AAs? Seriously cmon now. A stinking feather is more rare then an AA! You guys just dont understand the concept of some things being meant to be special and rare, and if lucky, a powerful device. But this all went down the drain, not sure if this can be fixed with so many out there.

SOLUTION - AAs need to be the single most rare items in the game. Period. Its healthy for the end-game, dont spoon feed your playerbase, it creates instant gratification and then boredom.

4. Raids need to be harder - BUT not fustrating! As of now, i have yet to experience a raid wipe since we started Live. Not one. What this created is, we basically got all our gear...very, very quickly. Do we remember controller? Do we remember FB? They were not even raids that could be done solo guilded most of the time without server help. Now i understand server performance just wasnt ready for mass numbers to raid at once without crashes and what not, and hence, making it to difficult would be impossible. But....its gotten alot better, you can start fielding 3-4 groups easy now. And i see the devs slowly tweaking raids little more challenging each time, great. But, keep at it. They need to be HARD. And by hard i mean, like EA Live hard. So this one, i let it slack a bit more simply because its not entirely your fault because of server problems and population, but dont let this goal ever dwindle. Dont let us milk raid items with no challenge.

SOLUTION - Bring back raid challenges how they were in EA Live

Here is my final thoughts.....MMOs thrive on end-game. This is what keeps a MMO going, this is what keeps your vets playing, your experienced ones playing, who in turn provide so much benefit to the community, so very important.

These suggestions are widespread, pretty much everyone from the top 3 guilds, BI, Static, VGE that ive talked too, agree that not having these among other things implemented have driven many end-game players away.

Im speaking for many, that, as much as we appreciate you devs for all your hard work, take a seat back and just really look at the picture here. Think about some of the things were telling you. We know key points why EnB was awesome, and were trying to help you get it back closer to that goal. So dont shut us out, dont get offended, dont take it personal. We all love this game, we want it see it get better, and we definitely dont want to become a ghost town.

Discuss these or other factors troubling you.

[SiSL]

I will not comment on raid part, not my interest in a slightest bit, however I disagree with AA's..  

 

I got plenty in live and and in live they were even more than what it is in emu. I don't exactly know if AA's "dropping from raid mobs", but if you are talking about asteroid AA's, they were more than now back then and same method of retrieving them... And "their value", have you checked lately in market? They start from 50 million credits per...  

 

May be you are lucky to fill your vault with them but not leaving them to rest then... If you don't want them and see them as instant grafication for yourself, please leave them on roids you find them so may be someone else who may need them can pick them up... 

 

"MMOs thrive on end-game. This is what keeps a MMO going, this is what keeps your vets playing, your experienced ones playing, who in turn provide so much benefit to the community, so very important."

 

Just an opinion on your end... Definitely never was mine... "MMOs thrive on end-game" sentence is obviously 20th century ancient relic today, ending with <insert random hidden threat to leave the game> since EQ^TM

Edited April 6, 2013 by SiSL

[Morumbi]

I will not comment on raid part, not my interest in a slightest bit, however I disagree with AA's..  

 

I got plenty in live and and in live they were even more than what it is in emu. I don't exactly know if AA's "dropping from raid mobs", but if you are talking about asteroid AA's, they were more than now back then and same method of retrieving them... And "their value", have you checked lately in market? They start from 50 million credits per...  

 

May be you are lucky to fill your vault with them but not leaving them to rest then... If you don't want them and see them as instant grafication for yourself, please leave them on roids you find them so may be someone else who may need them can pick them up... 

 

"MMOs thrive on end-game. This is what keeps a MMO going, this is what keeps your vets playing, your experienced ones playing, who in turn provide so much benefit to the community, so very important."

 

Just an opinion on your end... Definitely never was mine... "MMOs thrive on end-game" sentence is obviously 20th century ancient relic today, ending since <insert random threat to leave the game> 

Wrong. There are way way way way wayyyyy too many AAs in game. The market is generally broken, people don't know what things are worth, and credit values swing all over the place. Its more luck of the draw getting someone to sell. If you think AAs start at 50 mil... you've been getting ripped off. You can sell SSR8s for 300 mil and those are way more common than AAs were in live. Just to underscore this, I picked up (bought) 3 AAs on market last week. A lvl 7 Gahkur for 5mil, another for 10mil, and an 8 for 20mil. AAs are all over the place. It shouldn't be that way.

 

To me the single biggest thing ruining this game is the mass multiboxing. Yes, one alt is nice, but people fly around with 4 of them. You show up to hunt fish and there are groups with SomeoneJD, SomeonePW, SomeoneXY, SomeoneYZ. Its just retarded. Whats next? 12 box and run raids solo? I have 3 alts, but would gladly go down to one character if everyone else did. Being able to solo everything without interacting with anyone is a great way to kill an MMO.

[SiSL]

Being able to solo everything without interacting with anyone is a great way to kill an MMO.

 

Wait, I forgot World of Warcraft has been shut down because of this...

[Morumbi]

Wait, I forgot World of Warcraft has been shut down because of this...

 

 

WOW sucks. And wow you missed all the points in my post. Are you seriously trying to suggest that an MMO is BETTER when everyone can play 4+ characters at once? 

Edited April 6, 2013 by Morumbi

[SiSL]

WOW sucks. And wow you missed all the points in my post. Are you seriously trying to suggest that an MMO is BETTER when everyone can play 4+ characters at once? 

 

No, I merely pointing out things you hate or see "cause of ruining game" may be not facts but opinions on your end; the line you cross to force someone elses gameplay as game-breaking point of your own. 

 

Yes I do know WOW suck, but I didn't see it dying because we think it sucks or if people really desire to play like your own... Seen many many communities and games since MUDs man... Nothing changing there as "vocal minority" rule...  You can actually put entire community posts in a single scheme "You better Do this or you better do that, or  this be a warning te ye' many will leave since me & my friends around me talking about it" scheme, change theme and words.... 

Edited April 6, 2013 by SiSL

[shadowxsx]

Mastoras.

 

I am one who has left and all I can say that this is not the game I loved when I left live or the emu (still keeping up every so often on the forums).

 

Pre previous wipe I had alot of builds and were nearly 200% on everyone of them, but overall it felt far more like live. Now while build % was off, I do not agree with how it was when I left. If felt close to live but needed more at the beginning, but too much had been changed when I left and just reading here on the forums makes it far more apparent today.

 

I love a huge majority of the changes to this game as many of them were the most highly requested during live, but overall not feeling "like EnB"  to me" (at least when I left).

 

 

The biggest issue I feel is trying to make this like modern MMO games is over compensating. There were many changes I fought for (such as activated raids) that are now in (last I knew and have been over complicated for restriction purposes), but in many ways there has been too much work to making this game "modern", even though it was a predecessor to today's MMO games. IMO if you make an emu make it the majority of it's live version, but only improve where needed not everywhere and make it a different game altogether.

 

As for a downward trend I can not say for sure, but there was one when I left (everyone I knew except for 1 had left before me) but being gone as long as I have today I could be wrong or right. Yet I do know that even former guild mates that were playing have given up that were in my live guild that refuse to acknowledge the emu. And a few former EMU guildmates that are the same.

Edited April 6, 2013 by shadowxsx

[Morumbi]

No, I merely pointing out things you hate or see "cause of ruining game" may be not facts but opinions on your end; the line you cross to force someone elses gameplay as game-breaking point of your own. 

 

Yes I do know WOW suck, but I didn't see it dying because it is not your/mine style or if people really desire to play like your own... Seen many many communities and games since MUDs man... Nothing changing there as "vocal minority" rule...  You can actually put entire community posts in a single scheme "You better Do this or you better do that, or  this be a warning te ye' many will leave since me & my friends around me talking about it" scheme, change theme and words.... 

So you think the game is bettered by multiboxing 4-6 chars? Do you think it makes the game better or worse, I am genguinely interested in your opinion.

[SiSL]

So you think the game is bettered by multiboxing 4-6 chars? Do you think it makes the game better or worse, I am genguinely interested in your opinion.

 

I don't mind / get angry what anyone -- I mean anyone --  does, what anyone looted or what anyone achieved unlike OP unless they exploit bugs or "grief other players".  They got too many AA's? Oh my? Why the hell I would care for their game taste? You want to be better than anyone or "bestest(!)" but can't dare someone else have those? Bad news, items are unlimited...  

 

There were mutliboxing in old live, there are multiboxing now.. Nothing has changed there slightest bit...

 

If you ask me, it at least makes server a bit more "lively" than it actually is: I have spent literaly 5 DAYS asking for help for Aggripa quest testing while every "badazz" PW talking about what phat loot they have in market... Nobody responded... What have I done then? I leveled my own PW...  

Edited April 6, 2013 by SiSL

[Morumbi]

Because it hanges the entire game dynamic... In live there were far fewer accounts per head. Its changes drastically.

[shadowxsx]

Multi Boxing could be an issue. While many like me may run 2 toons such as a JE and whatever other class (JE for WHing). I have seen some multibox up to 6 toons (possibly more depending on names). In live you could run multiple accounts if you "knew the trick to it" and I did. If I tri boxed usually the 3rd toon was a storage toon.

 

 

But comparing someone who uses 2 accounts such as I did with a  JE for WH and another alt to someone who plays 6 classes at once is a different ballgame.

[SiSL]

Oh another bad news about multiboxing "ruining it", there are very few multiboxing around (even including 2 accounts only). You can ask any dev if you see them in chat and ask about how many unique IP's are there vs. how many characters online... You will be suprised...

 

Granted there are many characters of same people, but logging them at same time is not really as much as you think it is... 

 

PS: I have made similiar mistake about "assuming" most players uses /hidelogins turned out only 3 out of 1000 characters actually used it... See my epic fail here: https://forum.enb-emulator.com/index.php?/topic/8780-hidelogins-by-default/

Edited April 6, 2013 by SiSL

[shadowxsx]

Oh another bad news about multiboxing "ruining it", there are very few multiboxing around (even including 2 accounts only). You can ask any dev if you see them in chat and ask about how many unique IP's are there vs. how many characters online... You will be suprised...

Could be true, I spread the word to everyone I knew during live about the emu going "live". Just because no one was interested does not mean they had not told others. Or former emu guild mates suggesting it to another.

Edited April 6, 2013 by shadowxsx

[Morumbi]

Oh another bad news about multiboxing "ruining it", there are very few multiboxing around (even including 2 accounts only). You can ask any dev if you see them in chat and ask about how many unique IP's are there vs. how many characters online... You will be suprised...

 

Granted there are many characters of same people, but logging them at same time is not really as much as you think it is... 

 

PS: I have made similiar mistake about "assuming" most players uses /hidelogins turned out only 3 out of 1000 characters actually used it... See my epic fail here: https://forum.enb-emulator.com/index.php?/topic/8780-hidelogins-by-default/

This simply isn't true. There are enough people multiboxing to change the dynamic easily. Go to tengu navs or any station and you will see multiple characters more often than not. Across the whole galaxy maybe not as many multiboxing, but certainly enough to change the dynamic.

[SiSL]

This simply isn't true. There are enough people multiboxing to change the dynamic easily. Go to tengu navs or any station and you will see multiple characters more often than not. Across the whole galaxy maybe not as many multiboxing, but certainly enough to change the dynamic.

 

Well, as I said, don't believe me if you think "this simply isn't true", as I noted ask a dev (probably a SDEV) in chat... 

 

The ones you see in stations are merely alts of very few same people, often "reknown" crafters of "the very guilds" mentioned here. Lots of "guild-vault" characters etc. Check "spawn" points of infamous drops such as Prides, Breath of Life etc. you will again see the people of "the very guilds" mentioned here camping as well. It is 24/7 Greed that causing some items floating... And if so what? More GPU power to them... 

 

About tengu navs, everyone is welcomed to group up with other players since I'm not the one thinking "Being able to solo everything without interacting with anyone is a great way to kill an MMO." , obviously you love interactions and like to group up, why try to solo bosses there... Beside how does it change dynamics? In the end, what item drop goes to very same single person. Solo kill or group kill, only thing matters is probably a 30 seconds gain to kill a boss...

 

 

PS: Apologies to OP, drifted a bit towards multiboxing from "end-game(!)"

Edited April 6, 2013 by SiSL

[Xpo]

If you think that a particular encounter or aquisition of property is concidered endgame, then your imagination  and creativity are very limited.

Edited April 6, 2013 by Xpo

[Canman]

If you change the tado gate back to what it was in live and the FB not dependent on the tado gate why would anyone do the tado raid? Your just killing one raid with this thinking.

 

The troller does drop almost no good loot at all. Just the ED and shield are the only thing worth the time to kill him (all 15 minutes of it).

 

Gobb is the raid that needs to be adjusted. He drops way to much loot and he needs to be a device triggered event. Yes I said to much loot. 2 groups can kill him and he drops 7 to 10 items per raid.

 

 

I suggest make the raids all device triggered and the comps for the devices have a RARE drop rate all over the server on so many mobs that no one guild can camp it all. Next make the raids have class specific things for each raid. Next make the raids long enough that it takes many nights to complete. For example. Spawns 1 to 5 takes 2 hours to kill and at the end of 5 you get another device that activates waves 6 to 10 but can not be activated for 24 hours. Just an example here.

Another example is a king of the hill raid. Have 3 to 4 spawn spot and it requires a full group per spawn spot. If a group wipes raid over!! I think this would be kool for troller. Troller spawns in the center with each spawn spot 20k in a circular pattern around him. Every 120 seconds he spawns a full group of minions and sends them to a random spawn spot. 1 group takes on troller and same goes for them. If that group wipes raid over.

 

Raids should be HARD and have a 50/50 chance to succeed or fail. The loot should take months to get per toon not days.

 

Will not even get into the RD base. Spoken my peace about and got the same answers like a commercial for microsoft. Its my way or the highway attitude.

[rkgrau]

All raids being activated would be nice for the player base. Many of my guilds Euro players never get to the BBW raids.. simply because we have to raid them while they're up and those hours dont mesh with their playtime. Waiting around is not an option and thus many players have missed this content and will continue to do so. Also camping/controlling these timed raids is a huge factor in the turmoil between guilds on the server. Activated raids could ease that down a bit, give all players a better shot at game content and make for a happier healthier community overall.

[Mattsacre]

*sigh* I always love the "this game sucks because x,y,z isn't the way I want it" posts. Not.

 

Just because you feel triggered raid isn't to your liking... don't for a moment think that an exponential amount of other player's liking isn't true. It hasn't "kiiled" the raids, it's opened them up so that everyone can experience them if they so choose, not some select, elite few. The rarity of the drops for the trigger device you complain about? Odd, one breath you complain it's triggered not timed and it's taking the special uniqueness away do to commonality of it, but then in next breath complain that the rarity of drops is making it hard.. to you not see the illogic there? It's to common...but rare..can't be both :)

 

MMO thrive on end content...are you blind? End content driven MMO are always a troubled MMO...there are always the min-maxers at the end of content wave, and they're always wanting new shinies, those players, when they don't get the shinies the way they like or fast enough are cut-and-run players, they bounce for months on end and float to some other MMO for it's new shinies..they maybe come back when word of mouth gets to them, that there is a major content patch. What are they "contributing" to a MMO by their absence? Nothing. So the Devs are always under pressure on those MMO to make new and ever increasing shinies for the short attention spanned MMO jumpers, all that effort wasted on them that could go to making other players experience better. So you have what 10% (at best) of a player base driving the effort and wave of content, that the other 90% NEVER have a shot in hell of catching up to. When they finally get to that stage it's a ghost town, those "oh look..shiny" players can't be bothered to extend a hand to those other players, after all they are off chasing new shiny.

 

Make tado back to timed...have you even looked at the page after page of just why people DON'T want timed raids and want a activated raid? Most of us are just a bit older than the former teens we were, we have jobs, and kids, and spouses. We can't depend on mommy and daddy paying the bills so we can stay on line for days to do a timed raid. The whole point of writing content is so that someone (hopefully everyone) can actually experience it. With the majority of the fan base having RL limitations on their time, they will never get to experience that content without it being activated.

 

AA rarity...hmm you must be really lucky or an exaggerator, I don't know anybody with a vault full of them, with all the mining I do I have run into exactly 1. That's 1 in 6 months? I found them live like 1 every few months.. I'm mining about as much as I did then.  If you do have a lot of them, kindly tell me where you are getting them, I'm obviously doing it wrong :). If you feel there are to many, then by all means pass them along, let someone else enjoy them instead of gathering dust in your vault, if your actual complain is there are to many floating about for your taste, there is a simple expedient you can be proactive on, destroy them...there ..at leat that many isn't floating around... I'm sure that will make you feel better. hehe

 

Multi-boxing is "ruining" it . You don't want to multi-box, then don't. Maybe someone else derives pleasure from multiboxing, is it really my call to tell them they can't? No, you play your way, they will play their way, and I'll play my way...if you get some urge to tell me how to play, stifle your urge.. I'm not poking through your trash, looking over your back fence, looking in your windows kindly return the favor and mind your own damn business, your game play is yours, mine is mine..... butt out.

 

"But I don't like that they can "solo" stuff with a multibox". Notice the noun there? " I " it's your feelings, if it's a problem, it being you with the problem, it's you. Maybe someone likes to multi, maybe they were driven to it from desperation, maybe it isn't all or part multiboxed.  Maybe they are a hermit or antisocial, heck maybe they can't speak English. You don't know and once again, it's none-of -your-freakn-business! For the record I like to group sometimes, sometimes I don't, sometimes I multi, sometimes I don't. And not one minute of me not or doing a multi "ruined" the game. It's in your mind, alter your perception and you will be a happier person.

 

Raids need to be harder...hmm once again illogical. You don't like the drop rarity etc. Isn't that in it's self "making it harder"? It once again boils down to perception, you perceive that the raid isn't hard enough, well maybe you being on the leading edge of content have all the shinies that makes it easier for you, perhaps for another that don't have all that, it's a much harder raid. Maybe you being that hard core raider with a select group of fellow raiders really are that good and it's a breeze for you, especially of your group is geared and had the past experience of the raids knowledge to help you....ever think that maybe someone new to the raid might have a tougher time of it?

 

So, an idea: for the "make the raids harder" crowd. How about a "tour of the raids" raid that's timed? Call it something like "defending the universe" raid. You have to do X,Y and Z raid(s) to get the opportunity to run a "elite" raid, that's timed and can only be done once before have to run the cycle of raids again to reset your opportunity. Would that be hardcore enough for you? It would be timed (for that crowd), and time consuming (for that crowd), By virtue of having to do the prerequisite other raids it would be rare (for that crowd) and the raid itself you would need the stuff and tactics learned from other raids (for that crowd) and for those that complain there is to much "rare loot from raids" floating out there, that having to run the other raids to reset it, and timed should constrict access enough to make loot extremely rare for that crowd).

 

I'm not trying to flame or attack anyone with this, but time and again people post the game is ruined, simple ruined because of A,B and C. When in reality it isn't ruined. Maybe it's not exactly how they want things to be..but then what in life runs just like you want it? Most of these types of posts are a misperception on their part, they are slightly irritated by something and over react because it's well ruined don't you know >.<

[Amethyst]

I'm with Mattsacre.

I'm loving the game.  There is a lot more content, more missions (particularly for L150+), systems to explore, equipment.  I like the raid triggering (if only I could find a feather), but I would like to see more raids (loved the halloween raid PLZ can we haz it back).  I'd like to know where AAs drop - I mine frequently in high lvl places and not one L8 AA. Raids are hard for most people, and are means to obtain better kits which in turn makes the raids easier.  But they ARE hard when you first start.  I tiny whinge I have is the new menace makes it even harder for the next round of toons reaching L150.

 

Those people who rushed thru to 150 in a matter of weeks need to take a chill-pill and take a more relaxed look at a new char.  Its a game after all.

 

If you want to have some creative and practical input then please list ways that 'end-game' content can be added.

I can see Vrix in my future, Ole Homestead, Ardus, the Maelstroms.  And maybe some surprises?

 

We do have to remember this is not a paid workforce with a department of 50 techies. Props to the Devs and GMs. + + +

[GMan33]

First off all, every idea you guys want, are off the basis of your own needs. Everything I have proposed, are off the basis of WHAT EARTH AND BEYOND WAS IN LIVE - FACT. So don't come at me as the outsider, the one that doesn't understand. I'm bringing to light aspects of the game as it were, nothing more. Obviously you people are against this....so I must assume you did not like Earth and Beyond that much from the get-go....its the only logical conclusion.

Get it through heads, AAs drop, drop drop. If you cant get one, that's your own problem of not knowing the most efficient way to get one. But in EA Live...anyway you tried it was rare....that is what made them rare. But I'm not going to continue talking about this, as many are confused on this subject, its pointless.

Your fighting for a Tada-O-Gate triggered....hmm ok. I'm currently blown away by the amount of triggers that are happening...so many are experiencing this raid its so refreshing.....not. Tell me this.....you really think you would be able to raid Tada-O-Raid more by making triggers, compared to a timed spawn that would most likely trigger at least 3 times a week....EVERY week....open to ANYONE. Yeah again, I'm amazed how many people are making triggers for people to raid lol.

Also last I checked I did not create a character with the best gear. I, like you started with nothing. Logic dictates that I raided the end-game with non-raid gear at some point. Yet, again, the challenge was not that difficult....tada/fb/controller....even gobb. Yes, we beat all these raids, with no wipes, with poor gear. So don't sit there like you got any clue about raids, because the comments I read tells me your not anywhere as experienced raiding as one would think.

Yes, flash news, end-game in any mmo is important. Just because it might take you 10 years to get to max level, doesn't mean an mmo should not have a solid end-game. (look at swtor). You should be happy that the hardcore crowd voices their opinion on this matter, so that ONE day when YOU will be at the end-game, you might be happy it got some much needed attention already.

And yes, we recognize the devs are doing this on their freetime...I never expect stuff to happen overnight.

Oh and also, don't hit me with multibox issues, I never brought it up on this topic, it was brought up later down. I myself multibox 3 toons always. I love it, its nice, its convenient. Do I think that multiboxing adds negatives along with the positives...yes of course it does. But multibox was possible in EA Live that's why I don't tackle that. What I tackle is what EnB was...that's what I will always fight for, always stand for. For the game I fell in love with.

[Morumbi]

*sigh* I always love the "this game sucks because x,y,z isn't the way I want it" posts. Not.

 

Just because you feel triggered raid isn't to your liking... don't for a moment think that an exponential amount of other player's liking isn't true. It hasn't "kiiled" the raids, it's opened them up so that everyone can experience them if they so choose, not some select, elite few. The rarity of the drops for the trigger device you complain about? Odd, one breath you complain it's triggered not timed and it's taking the special uniqueness away do to commonality of it, but then in next breath complain that the rarity of drops is making it hard.. to you not see the illogic there? It's to common...but rare..can't be both :)

 

MMO thrive on end content...are you blind? End content driven MMO are always a troubled MMO...there are always the min-maxers at the end of content wave, and they're always wanting new shinies, those players, when they don't get the shinies the way they like or fast enough are cut-and-run players, they bounce for months on end and float to some other MMO for it's new shinies..they maybe come back when word of mouth gets to them, that there is a major content patch. What are they "contributing" to a MMO by their absence? Nothing. So the Devs are always under pressure on those MMO to make new and ever increasing shinies for the short attention spanned MMO jumpers, all that effort wasted on them that could go to making other players experience better. So you have what 10% (at best) of a player base driving the effort and wave of content, that the other 90% NEVER have a shot in hell of catching up to. When they finally get to that stage it's a ghost town, those "oh look..shiny" players can't be bothered to extend a hand to those other players, after all they are off chasing new shiny.

 

Make tado back to timed...have you even looked at the page after page of just why people DON'T want timed raids and want a activated raid? Most of us are just a bit older than the former teens we were, we have jobs, and kids, and spouses. We can't depend on mommy and daddy paying the bills so we can stay on line for days to do a timed raid. The whole point of writing content is so that someone (hopefully everyone) can actually experience it. With the majority of the fan base having RL limitations on their time, they will never get to experience that content without it being activated.

 

AA rarity...hmm you must be really lucky or an exaggerator, I don't know anybody with a vault full of them, with all the mining I do I have run into exactly 1. That's 1 in 6 months? I found them live like 1 every few months.. I'm mining about as much as I did then.  If you do have a lot of them, kindly tell me where you are getting them, I'm obviously doing it wrong :). If you feel there are to many, then by all means pass them along, let someone else enjoy them instead of gathering dust in your vault, if your actual complain is there are to many floating about for your taste, there is a simple expedient you can be proactive on, destroy them...there ..at leat that many isn't floating around... I'm sure that will make you feel better. hehe

 

Multi-boxing is "ruining" it . You don't want to multi-box, then don't. Maybe someone else derives pleasure from multiboxing, is it really my call to tell them they can't? No, you play your way, they will play their way, and I'll play my way...if you get some urge to tell me how to play, stifle your urge.. I'm not poking through your trash, looking over your back fence, looking in your windows kindly return the favor and mind your own damn business, your game play is yours, mine is mine..... butt out.

 

"But I don't like that they can "solo" stuff with a multibox". Notice the noun there? " I " it's your feelings, if it's a problem, it being you with the problem, it's you. Maybe someone likes to multi, maybe they were driven to it from desperation, maybe it isn't all or part multiboxed.  Maybe they are a hermit or antisocial, heck maybe they can't speak English. You don't know and once again, it's none-of -your-freakn-business! For the record I like to group sometimes, sometimes I don't, sometimes I multi, sometimes I don't. And not one minute of me not or doing a multi "ruined" the game. It's in your mind, alter your perception and you will be a happier person.

 

Raids need to be harder...hmm once again illogical. You don't like the drop rarity etc. Isn't that in it's self "making it harder"? It once again boils down to perception, you perceive that the raid isn't hard enough, well maybe you being on the leading edge of content have all the shinies that makes it easier for you, perhaps for another that don't have all that, it's a much harder raid. Maybe you being that hard core raider with a select group of fellow raiders really are that good and it's a breeze for you, especially of your group is geared and had the past experience of the raids knowledge to help you....ever think that maybe someone new to the raid might have a tougher time of it?

 

So, an idea: for the "make the raids harder" crowd. How about a "tour of the raids" raid that's timed? Call it something like "defending the universe" raid. You have to do X,Y and Z raid(s) to get the opportunity to run a "elite" raid, that's timed and can only be done once before have to run the cycle of raids again to reset your opportunity. Would that be hardcore enough for you? It would be timed (for that crowd), and time consuming (for that crowd), By virtue of having to do the prerequisite other raids it would be rare (for that crowd) and the raid itself you would need the stuff and tactics learned from other raids (for that crowd) and for those that complain there is to much "rare loot from raids" floating out there, that having to run the other raids to reset it, and timed should constrict access enough to make loot extremely rare for that crowd).

 

I'm not trying to flame or attack anyone with this, but time and again people post the game is ruined, simple ruined because of A,B and C. When in reality it isn't ruined. Maybe it's not exactly how they want things to be..but then what in life runs just like you want it? Most of these types of posts are a misperception on their part, they are slightly irritated by something and over react because it's well ruined don't you know >.<

Man, this response is a joke. You're talking to us like we are children. You do realize there may be more than one opinion right? Have you ever stopped to think that maybe your opinions on some of these matters are actually the minority? You talk about AAs being rare, when they simply are not; you talk about multi-boxing being a peference, as if it doesn't effect everyone else at the nav. You don't acknowledge that there are some seriously broken aspects of this game that were not in live. How can you expect this game to grow with such a close minded view of things? Someone as involved in this game as yourself could be a real asset to furthering it, but instead it seems like you just want to be the forum warrior making comments like "some of us don't have mommy and daddy to pay the bills". What is this, a school playground? I really hope you turn your attitude around and contribute to the discussion rather than resorting to belittling others viewpoints.

[Stanig[IS]]

I am currently in the process of moving, so havent had time to do much lately.  Ill keep it as short as possible.   I read most of the comments in this thread, and there is a lot of anger and a lot of people with various ideas of where the game should go or be.

 

This is like live, no that is, no this, no that.  K, let me put it to you this way.   Westwood as great as they are was not a perfect company.  This game failed.  You do realize that right?  What you see here are about a thousand die hards in a niche MMO that never had a subscriber base of higher than fifty thousand in its entire run.  Youre talking about the need to model the game and every thing about it after what turned out to be a very poor result.

 

You are arguing about an MMO original that utterly failed in the end scheme of things.  If EA felt there was money to still be made, they would have kept making money, that is just the fact.  Corporations do not shut down lucrative profit centers, they close the red ink ones and consolidate resources.

 

That is just the stark reality.  Nostalgia is all that is left for the game at this point, that is the primary reason people still trickle in, play casually.  This isnt a game for a hardcore achiever, it never was.  There was never a collections/badge system, no leaderboard, none of that stuff for bragging rights.  You had a ship and some equipment.  Quite frankly the game is at its most fun in its simplest form, without a ton of bells and whistles mega mmos (wow, tor, aion, take your pick) added to their games to hold the casual player.

 

 

 

Now, all of that being said, this is my take and is the way I have been developing for this project since last September.   I strive to achieve the closest I can to the original while changing what was broken in a way that makes more logical sense and is more functional.  What worked well would be preserved under this model with whatever changes need made to either make it work or fix a problem with it. (Kenu did a fantastic job with MPP/AV despite the limitation of not being able to figure out how to transfer the essence).  I tend to follow the examples ive seen from other members of the team, and add my own flavor.  Like when I added PP style items to the progen mission themepark some of you have done.

 

This game will never be a carbon copy of westwoods version, both from limited resources and from functional limitations (we are not a professional development company with 100 employees getting paid 60k+ a year to sit and work all day).  The EMU will always vary from original live, there is no escaping it.  The constant clamoring to make it that way is both frustrating and insulting.  Just be glad you have what youve got, this is the only EnB emulator im even aware of.  It is what it is, folks.  We do our best, and if anyone wants to put in hours upon hours of grindwork (that actually KNOWS what they are doing and arent just looking for the tag), by all means apply for a position on the team.  Realize we work as a team and being on the team wouldnt mean you just come in and change it how you want it, you work to a common goal with everyone else.

 

But thats the bottom line really, so many people bitch about the game as it is that have never lifted a fucking finger to get it where it is today.  I appreciate all of the love and all of the thanks, but threads like this burn the shit out of me.  I did see some ideas I could look into, but after the original post the thread kinda degraded into shit (derailed multibox argument).  Anyway, see you guys soon, im beat after a night of moving boxes to my new place. 

[VincentTH]

I am afraid suggetions to make valuable items rarer would make the ones who already have them richer.   Players in most MMO games, after discovering an exploit or a secret to make rich in the game, cry out about that, in order to deny others the chance of doing the same.

 

If I were the devs, I would only do that if the change to make the valuable items rare is accompanied by a wipe or partial wipe of the items (say you can only have 1 of those per all 9 game accounts).  If you want to make it rare, let's start by making it rare to possess the item in the first place.

[Terrell [BT]]

I am afraid suggetions to make valuable items rarer would make the ones who already have them richer.   Players in most MMO games, after discovering an exploit or a secret to make rich in the game, cry out about that, in order to deny others the chance of doing the same.

 

If I were the devs, I would only do that if the change to make the valuable items rare is accompanied by a wipe or partial wipe of the items (say you can only have 1 of those per all 9 game accounts).  If you want to make it rare, let's start by making it rare to possess the item in the first place.

I do think you've got a point, in that I remember some complaining about Cygnus 9 reactors dropping during the Halloween event in 2003, because more JEs got the recipe than had it before.  I was one of the players who benefitted from this drop during the event.

 

I would; however, support a reduction in the truly awesome L9 items, if more alternatives to the "entry level" L9 items were added.   Said items would be intended for relatively mass production, would be desirable alternatives to existing items, but not as powerful as the items that are intended to be rare.