The Benefit Of Public Raids

[snowy]

Following a brief discussion on the in game chat earlier here is an explanation for those who didn't play the Pegasus galaxy in live about how these raids can work and how they can benefit the in-game economy.

The benefits of the system described below are two-fold. Firstly "public" raids allow some raid participation for anyone, not just established names and faces and the big guilds. Secondly the system gives some much needed value to the in-game currency that at present is about as useful as the Zimbabwe dollar.

This raid system operated in Pegasus server, mostly it was used with great success on the old pre fishbowl "Gate raids" but can equally be applied to other scenarios. For the sake of this example I shall describe a gate raid.

Firstly the the raid organiser will call for participants on the in-game chat channels when it is known the raid is up. When enough players (usually it was 20-30 for gate raid) have signed up then they would assemble at the tada-O gate. During this time the organiser of the raid would "Auction off" all the big named items know to drop from the gate raid. The winners of the auctions would be noted and and all fees paid up front to the organiser or perhaps another trustworthy individual.
As the raid ensued the winners of the auctions would be called to collect their item from the corpses as they drop. Winners of items that did not drop on this occasion are refunded and all the rest of the auction proceeds are split equally between all raid participants.
An example of how it might have gone:


Raid is called and 20 players sign up to it.
Auction results as follows: (not a complete list I know, but to serve this purpose)

HOTDO 50m
FOTM 75m
Wrath 100m
Bulwark 20m
Bastion 50m
GOD 75m
DG 100m.

A total of 470 million credits is collected from the auction winners.

Raid takes place, and all drop except for HOTDO and Bulwark, winning bidders for these items refunded.

Remaining 400m divided up giving each raid participant 20mil for their efforts.



This system worked very well in Pegasus for a long time. Those who couldn't initially afford one of the "big ticket" items could participate in more raids and accumulate more funds. The prices paid will vary depending on who's in and how bad they need the item but over time a rough idea will be gained of what is worth how much.


I think it would make an interesting experiment if someone would like to try it out, the likes of Magoo or Vaden who we all know and trust perhaps? Shaddex knows the drill from Peggy so he might like to get involved too.

It would give some much needed value to the in-game currency, food for thought I hope.

[snowy]

Just to be clear, i'm not suggesting that allocated guild slots are done away with completely!, rather that slots or days are perhaps given for public raids too. Anyone, members of existing guilds or not, can participate of course, it's just that this way offers a chance for players that might not get the chance because their guild is small or they play at a different time of day to most of their guild etc.

[Ryle [N7R]]

Arent you a member of Static?

[Lot]

The formal agreement between guilds applies only to the controller and GOBB it does not include the fish bowl.

Fish bowl is straight foward as a raid because it is activatable and accessible 24x7. No waiting a random amount of time for the raid to spawn again. Much more civilized. Anyone that puts together a device can probably ask for help to run the raid if they are not a member of the larger guilds. As the device owner I feel you can reserve the items you want and allow the remaining items to be allocated to whoever helped out.

Fun is the main commodity in the emulator so I feel that an auction for fish bowl loot is unlikely. Players will probably volunteer to help out for the fun of it not expecting any rewards. Although it still would be nice to offer helpers any items you did not need. On the plus side it does not need 20-30 players to run the fish bowl in the emulator it can be done with between 6-12 depending how fast you want to go.

I played on Andromeda during live and was aware that Pegasus did things differently but still interesting to get the reminder. There were on occasion Pegasus style auction fish bowl raids held on Andromeda but not as often compared with how many were held on Pegasus.

[snowy]

Hi. No i'm not in static, i'm in Builders inc. Our guild can carry out the raids, no problem. I was posting up the procedure because many asked me exactly how it worked when I mentioned it in-game. It may turn out that this method for raiding will not suit the emulator but it would be interesting to trial and see how the players recieve it. We all know the in-game economy needs fixing. How that is done may eventually involve reducing the amount of drops and mining available but how many credits people have will be irrelavent if there are no uses for them anyway!

[Taluna6]

Remembers the Pegasus System. But i dont remember a refund since cash was collected after the raid for the items that droped (OMP mostly for Tada-o/fishbowl F7 for Bogeril raids) the winners came and payed for thier item and the fully charge and ammo comps where split between all group leaders that split /6 for each Member.
Pro:
Even a Newcommer that just arrived 135 (at least weapon and shield max) had a chance to get a slot in a Raid and cash for future bidding.
Hardliners that made many Raids could tell Newcommers what/where and when to do (i.e. Dont shoot Minions or we all will die)
I remember when i came to the raids (TE150 5xType A cash stat roundabout 500 000 creds) its was a Gateraid and Many ppl wanted the Smiters result i went out with 13 500 000 cash a good amount of dept and the Idea "I want a smiter's too someday when i have the 350-500m creds) Took me about 10 weeks and i had it and was back to 5M creds but so and so on i got all my items without beeing in on of the big guilds (i joined later)
contra:
Public raid was called and they came, usually on a spawn raid (Harvey/Troller/RD-Base) the Raidleader gave em 15 mins to arrive and started Bidding's which took some real time since i.e he called smiters fury they started at 250, next wrote 270,280, 290, 310,315,320,321,325,326,328,330,331 and so on till one of em gets highest bid..I remember some raids when bidding was over there was no boss anymore since i.e Anarchy 99 went in with a full raid team and stole the boss. If they Failed we laughed on the Doritos and NO ONE will give a JS
Ok we had long time for Bidding lets say 45 mins till all was done 15 mins for a Troller and 30 mins till all was paid and split to groups 1.50 Hrs for a Troller 4-5 hrs for a FB 3 hrs for a Tada-o gateraid, and scooter/MC since it was a trigger him till he gets mad and spawns raid could take a whole day.

[Ryle [N7R]]

Id like to add the part where credits are pretty well not currency right now. The economy is so inflated you could multiply the amounts by 10 and it still would attract much attention i reckon

I have a level 25 toon with 50 million on him, for perspective

[Bleakend]

I remember when I was running with just a few friends of mine we would build devices for the FB and run a "sort of" public raid on it. There was 4 of us, a JD/TE/PW/PP, we could have to ask in market constantly for a TT and anyone else who would like to help, although we didn't do it auction style, it worked out OK most of the time and usually everyone had fun. We generally would get requests to "reserve" loot from whatever healer or whoever else joined us, and we did so as long as nobody needed whatever item was asked for.
In any case, it seems like a majority of the server population is part of one of the three guilds. I dunno if thats because everyone sees us everywhere or the times we are logged on or whatever other reason you can think of. The point is that there just might not be enough people on to run a "semi public" or public raid on the FB/Mordana/RD base. We were doing this FB stuff 8 months ago and the most we ever got was one or two people willing to join us. Maybe when we get 500 players on average, but until then it will be difficult to do.

[Shaddex]

Of the Many public fishbowl raids I organised on Pegalag (thanks to a guildy keeping crashing and retaining the Bait), we took payment BEFORE the raid started.
Any payments for Non Drops were given back at the end of the raid.
The rest was split between the raiders.
Very good way to do it if organised correctly.

We could add feature to the Portal for organising public raids etc, but not sure....

Also, what happens on the Guild Raid rotation if there are 40+ Guilds wanting to do GOB etc ?

[Ryle [N7R]]

As far as I can tell, the rotation here on the EMU is just like it was in live on Andro. Only guilds that can do it alone generally get on with the other days designated as free for all days.

The only guilds large enough in live on Andro were Static, Merchant Marines, Omega Corps, and the alliance of The Omega Guard and a couple other guilds. It was worse then though, because the rotation was on a nearly 2 week timer, so it was basically 2 or 3 months before open slots came around. "Tryouts" were held by Static. It was very rare that any other guild or even group of guilds could get enough people to do them on a regular basis. In live it took 3 or 4 solid groups. And if you werent able to accomplish it within the time given for said Tryout, Static would take the spawn and that was that.

Ive never personally liked the guild rotation idea, as it tends to cause elitism and a sense of ownership that shouldnt exist in the MMO environment, if it were up to me all raids would be instanced/activated and/or public lottos. But thats me. Edited August 30, 2012 by Ryle

[DarkkHero]

And on Galileo we took what we want, and burned the rest!

[Ryle [N7R]]

That was pretty much why the rotation came into being on Andro. Before it existed it was basically Static/MM trying to outdo each other all the time, and literally no other smaller guilds ever had a chance.

People got so caught up in their guild tags on a single spawn that it literally became an at all costs attitude.

In my opinion that was one of the biggest flaws of the EnB raid design, and it still exists today. When youve got item X that only drops off of mob Y that only spawns at time Z and the spawn is in a publicly accessible location.... numbers and size always win. Period.

So theres no room for the little guy.

[Slayerman]

You all forgot about the Freedom Fighters on Andro, we did all the big raids and were up there with Static and MM

[Ryle [N7R]]

Yeah, around the time OC got big though, FF had started to be less around. I do remember you guys, but by the time I was leading raids and stuff, werent many of you all coming around.

[Mynd [BT]]

[quote name='Ryle' timestamp='1346336512' post='62555']
That was pretty much why the rotation came into being on Andro. Before it existed it was basically Static/MM trying to outdo each other all the time, and literally no other smaller guilds ever had a chance.

People got so caught up in their guild tags on a single spawn that it literally became an at all costs attitude.

In my opinion that was one of the biggest flaws of the EnB raid design, and it still exists today. When youve got item X that only drops off of mob Y that only spawns at time Z and the spawn is in a publicly accessible location.... numbers and size always win. Period.

So theres no room for the little guy.
[/quote]

Yup....lol. This is exactly how I remember it as well. My old guild (TOG) was allied with the Star Rangers and the Black Hawks guilds I believe, and whatever guild Serrina was in (may have been in one of the two mentioned, but can't remember which one atm). As for Dallia (MM) and Utena (Static)....they were pretty much competing against one another for the mantle of "teh uberest guild" lol.

Their change of heart concerning other guilds getting an opportunity to experience raids and getting in on the rotation had a lot to do with all the other guilds threatening to team up/band together and take the raids by force....even if it meant crashing the server lmao. This was a good incentive for those two as we were all aware that this drastic sort of action had already taken place on one of the other servers who were having this same type of problem with a guild(s) hogging all the raids.
[quote name='Slayerman' timestamp='1346404885' post='62600']
You all forgot about the Freedom Fighters on Andro, we did all the big raids and were up there with Static and MM
[/quote]

I remember FF and their being a part of the raid rotations on Andro along with OC.

[Terrell [BT]]

Serinna's guild was *giggle giggle* if I recall correctly (at least in late live). I remember some of the fishbowls she hosted, enjoyed them greatly. I think the fishbowl was one place where my JW got more play than my JE.

[Mynd [BT]]

[quote name='Terrell' timestamp='1346454467' post='62626']
Serinna's guild was *giggle giggle* if I recall correctly (at least in late live). I remember some of the fishbowls she hosted, enjoyed them greatly. I think the fishbowl was one place where my JW got more play than my JE.
[/quote]

I remember doing quite a few raids that Serinna had hosted....Mordana as well as FB. I do remember one particular Mordana raid that she co-hosted along with Galatea....lot of fun. Heck...more than likely we were in the same raid group(s) on several occasions.

[Ryle [N7R]]

Serinna was the best public raid leader on Andro. Even when all the guilds fell apart at sunset, she was still there organizing. Dang i miss those days.

[Taallonn]

Never have approved of paying for raid gear. If your in the raid you have as much right as the next person fighting with you to get said raid gear. Never will approve of "buying" my way into a raid for gear.