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Jamosite

Repair quality skill

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I do not know if you plan on giving the PP / JT any more skills for that matter the TS ( I don't use one that's why i sorta left it out),,,,

I am suggesting this off of a post I read about today so it is not my core idea.

a PP has a nice bit of skill points if you decide to not build anything or just build in one group area

the JT has a nice bit of skill points because PSI shield was removed

for the real question/suggestion

Can we add a skill that can help repair Quality? is this in the range of the Dev/GMs abilities?

how you lay out the skill is your call for example if you made it up to level 5 you can do 1-3-5-7-9 points of quality repair, we can not have it

fix everything back to its tip top shape that would kill the danger element in the game, but if you can make it fix something for just a few points

that would make these (assuming ) glitches were one shot one death takes a 100 % to 94 %.

This could be an in space skill, terminal build skill , what ever but check it out , everyone wants gas ore to be more usefull so if this can be

incorporated you could use it in the space station manufacturing terminal with some type of ore, something towards that effect.

What do others think??

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Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't this skill pretty much already in the game? Build ----- Skill. Granted it's item specific (Weapon, Shield, etc) and requires you to have it mapped so on unmanufacturable items there is no recourse. But one of your sugguestions was to possibly have it as something done at a terminal. Can't we already do that? Weapon built at 200%, damaged to 170%. Rip it apart, rebuild it, voila, 200%. (Maybe. >.>; )

If there was a Repair Quality skill it'd make most sense to give it to Trader classes. And I can see them as being the least likely to be interested in it. Why would a Terran Trader want to put points into a non build skill to do something their build skill can do? The only exception would be of course to classes who can't build certain things, and to things that can't be built.

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I think he is more referring to non-manu items. Once they take a quality hit, its there for good unless you can get a brand new one.

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so I guess from this post that all the new classes have the problem of too many skill points and not enough worthwhile skills... It would appear to just be a waiting game at this point until the devs can get around to it... which I know they will in time...

as for repair quality... that is what dismantle and rebuild is for so I think that is a wad... as for non-manu items... imo I think we should leave non-manu alone... at least for now... maybe once we go live and are looking to add things we can go that route if it seems to be a good fit...

I would rather see the new classes (TS especially as I dont know what PP JT have) recieve some raid useful skills that would actually make people want them... I actually stopped leveling my TS and made a TE... cuz I just oculd not figure out what the hell my TS was gonna do at L150 except mine and js (which 2 other classes that ahve raid utility can do)...

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I remember in live there was a discussion about having a terminal, like the build terminal, that could repair item quality on 'non-manu' items. The premise would be that you could only repair an item upto 125% (The maximum for a non-manu item), with each % costing more than the previous (ie 98-99% is more expensive that 97-98%), thus adding a good credit sink to the game, whilst preventing people needing to go out and loot some items twice due to quailty loss, which is more relevant on items that dropped rarely, like Controller loot.

It 'should' be possable to add a terminal, where you add an item and then pay money for each % you upgrade, not sure if it would get added or not and if it does, it wouldn't be for a while, but it would solve the annoyance of having to go out and replace non-manu items, whilst providing a good credit sink. It would have to only be for 'non-manu' items though, otherwise you start breaking the trading part of the game for builders!

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I think JT already has all of her skills, other than her Sharim Affiliation Skill. When she lost Psi Shield, she got 2 skills Build Reactor & Fold Space. JT now has same number of skills as JW (Reactor Opt was added before this). Now the Devs may decide to change some of her skills, or not, in the balancing phase if they find that JT needs adjustment to do her job. Or if she can't get an invite to raids/groups. JT requires 379 skill points to max out all her skills, that's less than any of the original 6 classes. Of the Original 6 classes PE and TW have the lowest skill point requirement to max everything(397), PW and JW have the highest (419), JE and TT are in between (412). Have not seen how many Scout & Privateer still have, though the Devs have mentioned that Scout gets Afterburn & Null-Factor field, as his last 2 skills.

I think that quality repair for non-manufacturable items would be nice, but I think that there should be an NPC on F7 that does it. It should cost a significant amount of credits and the item should have a limit on how much quality it can be repaired to. I know in Live I wouldn't use my Loony's Special Gizmoblatsit of Chili-Popper devices in fishbowls, because I didn't want them to lose quality since I don't think I could have done Lyle McDonald's mission again to get rewarded new ones.

I think for this to work properly, however, then non-manufacturable items would have to be tagged, with their starting quality, or for most non-manu items, make the amount of quality repair, to the max that said items could drop with. I don't know what that number is, but I have received non-manufacturable items as loot (in Live) with quality as high as 125%, however the mission reward item Loony's Special Gizmoblatsit was given at 200% quality, while the Chili-Popper was 100%. Would have liked such an ability to do this with my HoDo reactor which I got from the fishbowl, during one of Serinna's public raids, at 85% quality. So some mission items would have to have some type of tag that allowed the NPC to repair them to 200%, while things like Chili-Popper would be limtied at 100%, and mob drops would be limited at whatever the max a mob's item can drop at.

I think that if Quality Repair was implemented as a Skill, it would make most sense to give it to a Terran, since as builders they are unencumbered by racial restrictions. I don't know if another skill can be added to the Tradesman, other than their IC affiliation skill or if they would even want such a skill.

Edited so it can include all non-manufacturable items, rather than just those that cannot be replaced.

Edited by Terrell

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It 'should' be possable to add a terminal, where you add an item and then pay money for each % you upgrade, not sure if it would get added or not and if it does, it wouldn't be for a while, but it would solve the annoyance of having to go out and replace non-manu items, whilst providing a good credit sink. It would have to only be for 'non-manu' items though, otherwise you start breaking the trading part of the game for builders!

It is a good idea but it seems very hard to balance as not every non-manuf item has the same value. This could be solved by making individual prices for every non-manuf item but that seems a bit doubtful.

Also, certain buildable items were so valuable in live that a rebuild was too risky. These would also need to be included in the repair deal.

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It is a good idea but it seems very hard to balance as not every non-manuf item has the same value. This could be solved by making individual prices for every non-manuf item but that seems a bit doubtful.

Also, certain buildable items were so valuable in live that a rebuild was too risky. These would also need to be included in the repair deal.

I agree about the balancing. Also, the data the client and server exchange about manufacturing and analyzing are, as far as I know, pretty specific and sensitive. I think it would be a lot easier to implement this very much like Call Forward, as a command-line skill that you'd have to be at a very high level to acquire. Perhaps all the different new classes could split up the ability to quality boost certain items (i.e. PP gets Weps/Shields, TS gets Engines, JS gets Reactors/Devices)?

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I agree about the balancing. Also, the data the client and server exchange about manufacturing and analyzing are, as far as I know, pretty specific and sensitive. I think it would be a lot easier to implement this very much like Call Forward, as a command-line skill that you'd have to be at a very high level to acquire. Perhaps all the different new classes could split up the ability to quality boost certain items (i.e. PP gets Weps/Shields, TS gets Engines, JS gets Reactors/Devices)?

One other potential issue, what of those non-manufacturable items that are also no-trade?

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One other potential issue, what of those non-manufacturable items that are also no-trade?

Didn't think about that, but we could have the skill work on items in other people's cargo.

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Perhaps all the different new classes could split up the ability to quality boost certain items (i.e. PP gets Weps/Shields, TS gets Engines, JS gets Reactors/Devices)?

please... engines are the worst as is... please ts has enough problems :)... engines are the worst item in the game please dont waste anymore ts skills on them... its bad enough that they have to waste a slot on build engines...

although I noticed that you gave JS reactors/devices... really reactors should be enough... and maybe TS devices/engines...

it is also interesting to note in this thread that a progen and 2 jenpie class build reactors... but no terran class... hmmm... somehow we need to get some terrans on the dev team :) ... are terrans the only class too stupid to figure out how to build a reactor? am I missing something here? if prog have to build reactors cuz there is too much hatred between them and jenpies... I could start a few scalding defamatory threads directed at the jenpie to get them to hate terrans :D

Edited by Avani

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2 Progen classes & 1 Terran class builds shields, but no Jenquai, 3 Terran classes, and 1 Jenquai class builds engines but no Progen. Why should Terrans get to build Reactors? Also if Terrans could build Reactors why should PT, JE, and JT bother? It would be pointless if Scout could build reactors for JE/PT/JT to bother, since Scout would be able to build reactors regardless of race, while JE/PT/JT are all race restricted, AND Scout would be able to match them on Price as well. If Tradesman built reactors, then TT would undercut everyone else on price. There has to be at least 1 item that Terrans cannot build, or there's no point in the Progen/Jenquai Traders building, because anything they could build a Terran could build better.

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I'd definitely support some form of this skill as a 137 as I've said in many other post other places. :D Seems to be inline with the 'wow' factor or handiness factor of PS 137 skill.

Something like weapon repair skill only maybe have a money fee associated with it. I realize you can rebuild damage quality weapons, but for some of the higher lv stuff to rebuild could be quite expensive. So if your looking to only restore 2-20% quality would probably be cheaper this way. Less annoying too as you don't need to track down sometimes hard to get components.

Could easily make it so quality couldn't be restored higher then the original value. Or anything non manu is cap quality of 125% (I believe is cap from live for looted stuff?) and build stuff could be up to 200%.

High High HIGH yes rate on this! :D

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Terrell, Avani is taking the mick out of how classes are balanced, why take it so serious?

Can we please have an extra option to vote a post as TMI? :D

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well first... anyone that wants to build engines has my blessings... I will write the code myself... it will be the biggest waste of time in my life... but I would do it :D

how come whenever I put TS and reactor in the same sentence everyone always responds so definitively... anything in the game can be changed... if you think price is the issue then let them build reactors but without negotiate cost penalty (to make up for the fact that we have no terran devs and that terrans... the progenitors of the progen and jenpie race... have somehow become too stupid to create reactors)... to balance out any price nerf? Also, I never said that TT should ever be able to make reactors...

how come people make it sound like the whole future of the jenpie/prog race depend on the terrans ability not to make reactors... would people stop makin pw's or je's etc? seriously what is the real issue here? We can change anything to make balance... and tbh atm, the TS is the most poorly underskilled class in the game imo and are really due for some love :D

So how much would it cost me personally to have a terran that can build reactors... I would even settle for a jenpie or prog reactor builder that I can goto the makeover terminal and make to look like a terran :)

/edit btw please no one take offense at anything here in case I wrote some stuff wrong... I am just talkin here :) <--- see smiles

Edited by Avani
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well first... anyone that wants to build engines has my blessings... I will write the code myself... it will be the biggest waste of time in my life... but I would do it :D

how come whenever I put TS and reactor in the same sentence everyone always responds so definitively... anything in the game can be changed... if you think price is the issue then let them build reactors but without negotiate cost penalty (to make up for the fact that we have no terran devs and that terrans... the progenitors of the progen and jenpie race... have somehow become too stupid to create reactors)... to balance out any price nerf? Also, I never said that TT should ever be able to make reactors...

how come people make it sound like the whole future of the jenpie/prog race depend on the terrans ability not to make reactors... would people stop makin pw's or je's etc? seriously what is the real issue here? We can change anything to make balance... and tbh atm, the TS is the most poorly underskilled class in the game imo and are really due for some love :D

So how much would it cost me personally to have a terran that can build reactors... I would even settle for a jenpie or prog reactor builder that I can goto the makeover terminal and make to look like a terran :)

/edit btw please no one take offense at anything here in case I wrote some stuff wrong... I am just talkin here :) <--- see smiles

I don't disagree that the Scout needs some lovin', but I disagree with you on how the Scout should get more lovin'.

Scout needs more missions in his training sector, if that hasn't happened since the beginning of ST4. Seeker's training grounds teach her everything she needs to start out, and flows smoothly. Privateers training grounds are in pretty good shape as well, but I'd say that JT's are in best shape, PT's are pretty good, and Scout's need improvement.

I agree that engines need to be improved, in some manner, to make building them more worthwhile. For starters one could make higher quality engines have lower signatures than the same engine of the same level, though I do wonder about how this would affect 0 sig engines like the Solar Sail line or the Intent of the Resolute. Maybe there could be more buffs on engines L5+. There probably need to be some "must have" engines that are L7+ that can be manufactured. Skill points, however, can be an issue here.

Perhaps the Null-Factor skill that the Scout is supposed to get could return some damage the way that E-Shield does at L5+. To be fair to the JE, whose L5+ E-shield cannot return Energy damage, perhaps null-factor would be unable to return Explosive damage. (L7 E-shield can also turn some incoming damage into reactor power, as long as it's not energy damage.) E-shield would still have the advantage of increasing your deflects. (not sure if Null-Factor would do that)

Scout still has his afterburn skill to obtain, perhaps at higher levels it could benefit groupmates as well. Much the way that Scan 5 allows all group members to see a cloaked object when detected, and Scan 7 shares scan range. I do remember that one of the devs mentioned that the Afterburn skill would increase speed, at higher levels warp, and give you some small ability to avoid incoming damage.

Wouldn't be against the idea of Hacking being replaced on the Scout with something more useful, provided it didn't make the Scout equal or better than the Sentinel in firepower. I do agree that L5 Hacking on a Scout is useless, since as a miner, he will mostly face Bio-mobs. Should proably be a new skill designed just for the Scout, if that's doable.

On Scouts & Building Reactors, why make a Seeker or Privateer who can make 2/3 of all the manufacturable reactors (if reactors were divided equally among races), when you can make a Scout that would be able to build ALL the manufacturable reactors in the game? You would have made an explorer, that can outbuild all the Traders on the one build that distinguishes Seekers and Privateers, from the TT (JT outperforms JE on reactor building due to Negotiate, PT due to being the only class that can build Progen reactors & Negotiate). That's why I'm opposed to Scouts building reactors. When it comes to their build skills, they can build devices better than JE or PE, and neither JE nor PE can build engines.

Negotiate is a skill shared by all Terrans, and the Trade professions, I don't think that should be changed. Not being able to Negotiate, for a Scout, would be quite inconsistent with Terrans being all about the money. "Ain't Nothing goin on but the Rent" was a phrase invented by a Terran lady.

JT, PT, and Scout, are likely to get more equipment designed for their specific classes at some point in the future.

Edited by Terrell
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Since this has turned into the santa wish list thread:

When this game goes live I'd like chinese players to be invited to play as red dragons

Ofcourse they will be chinese farmers that have been expelled from other games. To lure them here a small portion, like 1 USD per month each, of the donated cash can be used to pay them as that is a high wage in their country.

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well if something amazing is done with engines and afterburn and null factor becomes real live useable I need a TS in my grp skills then yeah we are ready to roll... but tbh imo I really dont see that happening... promises of engines have been around since live beta...

I think if I am not mistaken the skill you are talking about to replace hacking is bio-repression? a TE skill... and while I think that works on bios... it does lack some raid functinality? Also I would not be against having the scout only be able to make 2/3 of the manu reactors in the game like the progies and I wouldnt mind if negotiate did not apply to reactors (just write in the story line that we have to pay a fee for the knowledge of building reactors on each build?)... as for null factor returing damage... I am forced to think of the prog skill that returns dmg that is fun for farming rep but not too fun otherwise, and with L8 shields do I really need that kinda aggro generation...

I also see imo Afterburn never ever becoming a viable skill... speed is not an issue in this game (warp or impulse) at present and a small deflect with L8 shields is meaningless. My current L60 TE already has what 4500 warp? so by 150 he will easily be at cap if I chose to spend the points there... I am not hiding anything here by saying I like to play terrans and having been a kiter all these years, I cant think of anything that I was unable to kite due to lack of impulse speed as is... as a terran navigate was one of the last things I put points into and only cuz there was no place left to put them...

but we are way offff topic and got here cuz it was put out there that the TS get another worthless skill which would be repair quality engines... and again in that regards I guess all there is to say is show me enough engines worth repairing that I would put the points into it or someone would pay the credits...

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No, Avani, I'm not talking about the TW's biorepression skill which IMO should remain TW exclusive. I was thinking of, if it's possible to do so, a new skill being designed that is Scout exclusive. That way when Scouts are done & Balanced, they would have 3 skills that are exclusive to them. I was pointing out why I agree that hacking on a Scout is useless, since you're probably going to encounter more bios than mech mobs when mining.

If Afterburn gives you a chance of avoiding damage, as in dodging the attack, it's a pretty big deal. The attack that doesn't hit you or your groupmates does 0 damage, while deflects only would reduce the damage on a successful attack. Kyp describes it in Terran Scout & Level 8 shields thread as follows:

I'm not going to give exact numbers at this point in time, but yes I can give some details.

  • Afterburn
    This particular skill was a remnant from early documents regarding the game that eventually became live. It was meant to originally boost your thrust speed. Now with that in mind, since the game format changed so did the functionality (and worthiness of that skill). It has been reinvented a bit, it will be giving a bonus to thrust, turn rate, warp speed, and to a somewhat smaller extent avoidance capabilities. This means you'll be faster and dodge more. It will eventually also have some group wide effects if you spend enough points in the skill.
  • Nullfactor Field
    This one will be a type of energy field that will give the scout abilities to negate environmental hazards they can face. It will have a cost to the scout to prevent it from making them dominate the JE's environment shield. They will lose a percentage of the overall capacity of their reactor in exchange for an increased recharge rate and each level will include a new environmental effect that they negate or mitigate to some extent.

Balancing is to be determined going forward, so don't get used to anything as these skills do appear. Just know that the above stated is the intent for them at this present time.

Would like to know more about them as well and if any intentions w/r/t these skills has changed.

My JT does around 5500, at L150, with a L8 engine (Crystalline Dynamo), 200% RR+, & 200% Charging Unicorn. Even a L9 engine, unless I got her a L9 Ursa (5000 warp), wouldn't get her to the warp cap of 6K. Don't know if she could reach the warp cap if she had L9 devices instead of L9 engines. What's the difference in warp speed between a 200% L8 RR+ and a L9 RR+ of 200% quality? Is it more than 250? Could also be dependent on which devices are introduced between now and when the emulator is ready for live status.

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I guess my post's intent lost focus a bit even though these suggestions are good.

Are We considering a repair quality skill? , it was less about new classes having too many points and more directed towards non manufactureable items.

i'm suggesting the trading class and the new seeker class take on these skills.

you could repair already manufactured items but it would me more helpful for the non buildable items.

a command line skill works for me if you can work it in.

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When it comes to repair quality, how about the Privateer get it, and have racial restrictions waived for it. It could be their Collegia Affiliation skill.

Especially since PT only has 4 build skills, compared to TT and JT's 5 builds.

Edited by Terrell

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Seems like that would favor the PP a bit too much.

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It would remove the only real risk you ever had from being incapacitated...

And it would mess up the rebuild business...

This is a pretty severe game-changing suggestion...

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It might, but the OP has a point that it kinda sucks that non-manu items are forever doomed to whatever quality they drop at, or worse if they're damaged, though it occurs to me that these items might be balanced this way: maybe non-manu items are that way because they'd be overpowered at any quality above normal drop levels. I'm not really sure, because I'm not intimately familiar with the game content, so I'm just here to talk about the technical aspect of it.

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I liked the idea of terminals with increasing cost, lord knows this game needs some kind of money sink, just make it so no item can be repaired above 100% no matter what and it costs a ton of money.

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