New and "improved"? 100HU question(s)

[Mattsacre]

Sorry not trying to be hyper critical bayakee but missions discriptions are clear as mud...again.

Talked to Kerr, sent to both Ionna and Tiberius ship yard, talked to shipyard, got form c and explaination of, sent to nostrand vor, talked to all the npc there, took the weapon one (PW) it says in descrition: "must be ABLE to analyze rifle V projectile"..if it is intended that we " HAVE ANALYZED rifle V" before they talk to us agian (which they don't at present) it needs to say so. I have weapon build L5 skill so would be ABLE to.

Since all npc ended convo tree, I went A. to endriago planet to talk to Ionna (she wouldn't talk to me) but on checking mission log that mission had closed. B. tiberius ship yards,were it won't talk to me either. So in my mission log I'm left with these (2) 100HU missions (1 being the bonus one):

Joint Operations 2/6 "completion of this stage contributes 33% towards your HU"..no further info.

Progen Hull 100 Option, Build 1/3"to continue must be able to analyze rifle V projectile"..no further info.

I have returned to nostrand vor npcs and tried to advance convo..none.

I have returned to endriago npcs and tried to advance convo..none.

I have returned to tiberius shipyard (2x) and tried to advance convo..none.

I have returned to Kerr and tried to advance convo..none.

So were does this leave me other then the creek without that high tech paddle? Kindly advise me on the new and improved 100 HU I would at least like to aquire that even if the weapon ones don't work out.

[nimr0dbbow[IS]]

The only way the 'able to' analyze can be implemented as a current mission is for you to analyze it. It is best if you analyze it during that mission step, but you can have it analyzed then advance it.

You have to keep the Form C in your cargo hold to do any option. This is a mission critical item. The form is required to initilize and complete any option.

The Tiberius Shipyard will not advance the 33%...

Only by completing modules will you advance this. The mission has been tested by Betas to state it works fine.

The Form C should infer where you can obtain options from. Its why it has a large description.

Do not loose this form. You need it for your hull upgrade.

You have never been sent to Ionno for the level 100 hull upgrade.

:: Warden Orphant will have a option for you

:: Vinda will have an option for you

:: Reclaimer Nyol Watt will have option(s) for you

:: Archetechti will have options for you

Some options become unlocked after doing the above.

[nimr0dbbow[IS]]

Reclaimer Nayol Watt has the "Payment" options. But be warned, take these in the knowledge that all you ever will receive is a hull upgrade. He has 3 options where the payment is divided down, so for Progen who have only found 2 options they still can do 1 payment option to complete the set.

It is possible. It has been tested by Skeletor to destruction.

Note:

The initial dialogue from the Tiberius Shipyard will inform you how to unlock the Combat Option. This is not available in the start and this option is needed for the "Capture the Cargo" bonus quest tree.

[Skeletor]

Build Weapons - Basically you need to be Trade level 30 with build weapon skill at level 5, Aquire a looted Rifle V and analyze it the mission will update where you recieve futher Orders.

(The mission is saying you must have build weaps 5, I belive Byahkee will re-word the mission soon)

If you read form C it gives you the NPC contacts.I ran though this today with no problems. All missions updated correctly and advanced the master mission to completion

I did the Wardens,Vinda and Telums mission to aquire the Hull Upgrade.

[Mimir[IS]]

Reclaimer Nayol Watt has the "Payment" options. But be warned, take these in the knowledge that all you ever will receive is a hull upgrade. He has 3 options where the payment is divided down, so for Progen who have only found 2 options they still can do 1 payment option to complete the set.

It is possible. It has been tested by Skeletor to destruction.

Note:

The initial dialogue from the Tiberius Shipyard will inform you how to unlock the Combat Option. This is not available in the start and this option is needed for the "Capture the Cargo" bonus quest tree.

This is what confuses me. There are multiple choices that can affect the outcome of your characters build/future weapons or bonus. If one chooses incorrectly (not catastrophic) but only gets the hull upgrade. I think there should be some sort of warning that this will or may occur. (In game...it is not enough for it to be only here) Having choices is good but knowing how those choices will progress the character is important. It is down to not only reading the message text and interpreting the message correctly, but a game of chance, if one selects the correct path.

If the missions need to be cryptic to be interesting (I don’t agree) then at the very least give enough information that the user will be able to make the correct decision based on his or her character design.

If the missions are going to be based on chance I suggest you not go to all the trouble of writing detailed missions and just open up the casino, and allow the user to spin a wheel for the prize. At least then they could see what is possible to win.

Edited May 3, 2010 by Mimir

[Mimir[IS]]

And here is what I was suggesting... mostly a joke..

20,000,000 per spin with a maximum of 3 spins per player, unless the 2 more spins hit then 5 total for a total credit debit of 100,000,000

[seekeronos]

And here is what I was suggesting... mostly a joke..

20,000,000 per spin with a maximum of 3 spins per player, unless the 2 more spins hit then 5 total for a total credit debit of 100,000,000

Speaking as someone who would essentially have to reformat his windows PC and spend a good 6-10 hours reinstalling service packs and the other software on that machine in order to have a chance at loading EnB EMU "the right way" to even get access to Altair II and Nostrand Vor....

... I paid for my HU 100 and 135 like a Terran.

BUT!

I would gladly pay 20M credits for a chance to "spin the wheel" and get a BB sample or even the ammo samples (I can ask my guildies to build the PLs themselves).

Really now, I'm not joking.

[nimr0dbbow[IS]]

Well,

As soon as the BB is actually dropping in the game, those missions for both samples of ammunition and launcher prints will be removed. As will the CFB mission once that is in game. These are just 'sweeteners'. The real intersting stuff that will remain will be from the Agrippa Technology.

The route is your own choice.

Actually, if the Privateer does the Build Reactor mission or the Sentinel does the build device mission they don't ever need to go down the Capture the Cargo route. Capture the Cargo was always intended to be combat oriented and be off a combat mission. This was as the storyline increases different options can be inserted at the hull upgrade stages; makes it more current and less static.

The other thing to remember it is a stress test and as stated lots of times "missions are subject to change".

[Mattsacre]

Sorry..you really need to revisit the missions, for a PW to follow through on his mission he needs to do a 10 step fetch n' scan for warden (gaining 33% hull) then be sent to PW class leader for a combat mission that intails killing 5x32, (n x 35), (y x 39) [counldn't get past the 32 so dont know number need of 35 and 39] in a grav field (no warping for escape) populated by L66 manes 2-3x L48 renegade progen commanders, L45 sabine reclaimer, 2-3 L63 manes , several L45 manes...L43 manes..L32 manes oh and couple of L42 renegade progen also. This area is to hot and deadly for a PW pre 100HU to handle solo and would argue perhaps even a full 135 HU.

Even if the PW pre100HU could withstand all the insta-death mobs the L32 is a single spawn with a 30 min respawn rate...so for 5 of them thats a 2.5 hr camp in that area just for that step alone. I Haven't timed the other, I'm sure the respawn is comparable. This for a PW to play to type is both unreasonable and insane. The point is to get a 100HU at appropriate skill level, not wait until L135 and L9 guns/L9 shield/L9 reactor to be able to withstand the areas hostile mobs.

I know the next words to come so let me head them off: "then group up"...If you are so wedded to this forced grouping schema then by all means force the groups to the "bonus" missions..however I in my and I'm quite sure many other player's opinion a HU mission should be "do-able" solo. You should not be forced to round up a bunch of other players or join a guild you may or may not like just to complete a HU. Your next answer: "well you have the option of just buying the HU" this also is true..but by your design if you choose this course you are forever more locked out of any future bonus missions and/or recipes. Once again a forced grouping to achieve something that should be solo do-able. Perhaps on the next upgrade you may have a guild or group that you want to gather for that next tier of "bonus" mission..that if you took the terran path you would be precluded from doing.

In short the "improved" missions? Need to be "reimproved" to remove progroup bias.

In a little investigation about the other routes for other classes to type...vinda's mission:5 secure container, 10 escape pods..not so bad..a little run fetchish but doable, but then 60 Titanium, 300 Andromesite, 300 Chromium..really? A bit excessive don't you think? How long would a miner have to camp those ores to achieve a stack of not just 300 of 1 ore but another stack of 300 and a partial stack of 60 of a high demand ore? So whats going to be said "get a comps player to rip it" o.k. besides the fact another forced grouping..the cost WAY more than a HU would cost..and again very time (and carpal tunnel enducing) consuming.

Per your above post about being able to use Nayol Watt to buy off 33% of the HU...you have to take great care not to follow the confusing instructions that lead to the 100HU buy out..I can see potential errors from players thinking its the 33% and actually getting the 100% option thus being shut out for bonus. (I have both the 33% language mission and the 100% mission in mission log..they ARE confusable)

All this is not to "pile on" but to perhaps offer a differing view on progen direction...if only one perspective is used from concept to completion often unseen consequences can ensue. Consultation and input is a GOOD thing.

[nimr0dbbow[IS]]

Ok then,

At level 100 (average CL 33) what mobs that are enemies of the Progen would you like to go against? The 32 is average CL -1 to you, the 35 is average CL +2 and the 39 is average CL +6. Is that unreasonble? Just out of intrest, what was your CL? In fact I'm wondering if a Combat Option may have a pre-requisite of CL 29. This will mean the mobs are within 10 CL of you.

Changed on Play.

And Developer:

Go South of the Wreckage and you should start to see CL 32, 35 and 39 Renegade Progens

I've removed the Chavez and Manes spawn that shoudn't have been brought through.

However, your other assessment of the CL of manes is incorrect.

Of coursem if you are looking at an external site detailing the mob placement it will be. Currently the only manes that should be there are the 2 CL 66 and if you follow the roids you can avoid them too.

Agggh... looks like some other manes slipt through the net. This has been amended on the database I have access too, but it looks it may be a little hairy up there until x date it can be copied over.

Chavez anyone?

I can amend the mission to send you after these, remember CL will be of 32-39 though.

* This requires a server reset/restart to occur *

==========

Yes wording could be better but either you have the one item to explain the wording (limited text) or you fully read what the shipyard told you. The shipyard said "You can't do combat mission until we discover what happened to the PAX..." or words to that vein; which does mean you got to find it first.

Point taken on the ores,

Version 1.2 will be seen on server reset

Requirements:

Refined Titanium: 20

Andromesite: 60

Chromium: 60

The others remain as it, a little less expensive.

===========

With the Nayol Watt what I want it to say is you will be paying in installments. Trouble is you can spend as long as you want on the mission text but people don't read it. The item on the other hand only has a limited space for text.

[garblesoup]

Wow, that's really impressive. Not only do you obviously put a lot of time and effort into developing these missions but it's clear you listen to the feedback from the players and do what you can to adjust the content appropriately.

I'm still a ways away from OL 100 mission (only just recently completed the 50) but just wanted to say I appreciate your efforts Byakhee.

[Mattsacre]

KK nice I am CL 36 w/ L7 guns (mortar rifle mix) L7 shield L7 reactor OL 106 PW.

Didn't know you have moved the mobs a bit south..when I visited with PW they were west of wreck and had 3 L48 edging them and a L42..those L48 have 6k beam range well out of L7 projectile range. To the north is a L66 manes..it does wander down to the wreck now and then..so if you dont back into it then you ok. But those L48 commanders they are harsh..they swarm you fast. Like you said a few other manes must have slipped through.because there was at least 1 non L66 (think it was 63). The manes if you keep eye open you can keep from if you don't get within 6k they dont grav link you..the commanders though..that 6k range and fast thrust..even at my lvl 3-4 shots is into hull. 3 DOA was enough for me to pack it in from those guys

I'm not crying about the 32-39 for a Pw if you cant solo 1 on 1 that lvl then your being over optimistic, My point was the location and surrounding mobs placement..those 48 arrrghh I'm not argueing the removal of the 48 either..those are the things tht drop the loot my other toon uses (see I'm familiar with that area ) namely WP reactors. If you was to pack the 35-39 tight somewhere and make them solo aggro that is good..has a PW pausing between fights for recharge etc. or packed loose with line of sight aggro for other 32-39 so he has to work his way in to get to next tier. The 32 when I visited with PW was 1 spawn with approx 20-30 min respawn rate..to get 5 thats 2-2.5 hr camp.

The previous mix a week ago (my PP) had all those other mobs I mentioned in previous post and the same L35,L35,L39 long respawn rate..I could drop 8 L48 and the 2x L45 sabine and a L63 mane by the time another of the 35-39 would respawn.

Side note: there are also 32,35 in endriago but have a even longer respawn rate and are invarably camped.

Thanks for response and possible rework..I'm sure the PS-PP looked with relief on the lower ore requirments

As to chavez or not..for a PW the mob type isn't a huge factor for mission purposes the possible drop from renegades are nice (rifles and such) but with faction in again I'm sure people whouldn't mind chavez either lol, with chavez however with everyone lvling RD from chavez I can forsee possible campers especially if they add the scaling they are considering.

All and all except the unintended mob creep if put as you said that would make the PW in line. And about my "group-no group" thing. Many (like me) enjoy the PW-PS for the PVE primary solo-ability (yeh PS need ammo built), I and they don't mind throwing in to help people at will, but what I hated about EA endgame and other MMO is the push for force group content. For things you HAVE to do for advancement (like HU) I find it loathsome when they (especially WOW) would put steps in where you HAD to find a group to complete..I truely would hate this great game to go that route. I like groups..like raids or boss camps..they fun. But I find it relaxing and challenging to sort of go 1 vs.1 PVE too..ask any miner, its sort of got its own pace and hypnotism to it hehe.

Yes its a MMO and player enteraction is a given..in fact must to get gear etc. but MMO have all types..even us grumpy old hermits =], just like to hold out not to exclude us content push.

As always thanks byakhee.

[nimr0dbbow[IS]]

The combat option is not the completed article.

The completed article would have you flying a path clearing it of enemies that would mysteriously spawn on you. As soon as I can lay my hands on the code for combat jobs...

[Skeletor]

Just to confirm potential problems with ths (Any) Hull Grade, just ran throught the combat mission part with Matt killed the required mobs mission advanced. But ... speaking with Tiberius Shipyard he had 10k removed and forwarded onto I-oanna. I think this related to faulty hull upgrade missions a week of so ago. A GM had to do a manual 75HU for him and i think this is having an effect on his ability to complete.

I ran through te combat portion prior to helping matt and completed no problems. this was a fresh character tho who didn't experience the faulty HU missions, so that is the probelm i think.

[Willy]

Just tried to do the 100 HU last night on my PS. Started off doing the intelligence gathering. From the way I was reading the post on the HU, i figured there were 3 different ways to complete the HU, one combat based for PW, one explore based for PS, and one trade/build based for PP. This doesn't seem to be the case since when I finished the intelligence gathering mission, I was sent on the combat portion looking for CL 32-39 mobs.

Well, since my CL is only 18 right now, I decided to try and opt out and just buy the HU because I didn't want to try to get 20 more CL just to finish my HU. So i talked to the NPC that you can buy the HU from. She took 160,000 credits from me, and my mission log said to report to shipyards for HU. Well, now the shipyards are not talking to me. No messages popup when I target them. Not sure if it's a bug since I started the bonus mission, and then opted out of it part of the way through.

[Mattsacre]

Just tried to do the 100 HU last night on my PS. Started off doing the intelligence gathering. From the way I was reading the post on the HU, i figured there were 3 different ways to complete the HU, one combat based for PW, one explore based for PS, and one trade/build based for PP. This doesn't seem to be the case since when I finished the intelligence gathering mission, I was sent on the combat portion looking for CL 32-39 mobs.

Well, since my CL is only 18 right now, I decided to try and opt out and just buy the HU because I didn't want to try to get 20 more CL just to finish my HU. So i talked to the NPC that you can buy the HU from. She took 160,000 credits from me, and my mission log said to report to shipyards for HU. Well, now the shipyards are not talking to me. No messages popup when I target them. Not sure if it's a bug since I started the bonus mission, and then opted out of it part of the way through.

The 160k amount you paid is only 1/3 of a L100 HU, one of the intended options per bayhkee's previous post is you can take 1/3 buy out from nayol watt in arx magister and complete 2 of the other tasks for a total task of 3, Nayol watt also had a convo tree option you could have took that was a 100% HU buy out (like a terran) after he gave you the 100% mission he would send you on to shipyard where they would have taken the credits for HU.

Per Baykhee's post it is intended (I think)if you took the 33% from Nayol Watt you could still do 2 of the other possible 4 and still complete..thus not having to do the combat but the other 2. The other 2 (other than combat) are the DCO Wardens tasks (10 step fetch 'n scan) and Vinda's (fetch/supply items/ores) at endriago planet. You can also do the Achetecti in Nostrand Vor planet/city (scan/build) for 1 step.

Becuase of a bug in system I wound up doing the wardens tasks(10/10 fetch 'n scan),archetecti build weap task (scan and build 5xL5 rifles) and Nyaol Watt's 1/3 buy out. Because of the bug and not being able to get HU credit I did (with skeletor's help) the PW additional combat phase the warden sent me to PW class leader to get (kill 5xL32, 3xL35,1xL39 renegade progen) after which the bug was confirmed that after 4 steps it still wasn't crediting me (reasons believed to be because of skeletor's post above).

I don't have the exact specifics of what you can do for Vinda, but per above post of Baykhee the mass amounts of ores she wants is intended to be reduced and you may consider that route also. Anyway as discussed in detail elsewere if you take that 100% HU buy out you are supost to be shut out on future bonus missions, skipping any potential recipes/skills that may be attainable through this route.

[Willy]

The 160k amount you paid is only 1/3 of a L100 HU, one of the intended options per bayhkee's previous post is you can take 1/3 buy out from nayol watt in arx magister and complete 2 of the other tasks for a total task of 3, Nayol watt also had a convo tree option you could have took that was a 100% HU buy out (like a terran) after he gave you the 100% mission he would send you on to shipyard where they would have taken the credits for HU.

Per Baykhee's post it is intended (I think)if you took the 33% from Nayol Watt you could still do 2 of the other possible 4 and still complete..thus not having to do the combat but the other 2. The other 2 (other than combat) are the DCO Wardens tasks (10 step fetch 'n scan) and Vinda's (fetch/supply items/ores) at endriago planet. You can also do the Achetecti in Nostrand Vor planet/city (scan/build) for 1 step.

Becuase of a bug in system I wound up doing the wardens tasks(10/10 fetch 'n scan),archetecti build weap task (scan and build 5xL5 rifles) and Nyaol Watt's 1/3 buy out. Because of the bug and not being able to get HU credit I did (with skeletor's help) the PW additional combat phase the warden sent me to PW class leader to get (kill 5xL32, 3xL35,1xL39 renegade progen) after which the bug was confirmed that after 4 steps it still wasn't crediting me (reasons believed to be because of skeletor's post above).

I don't have the exact specifics of what you can do for Vinda, but per above post of Baykhee the mass amounts of ores she wants is intended to be reduced and you may consider that route also. Anyway as discussed in detail elsewere if you take that 100% HU buy out you are supost to be shut out on future bonus missions, skipping any potential recipes/skills that may be attainable through this route.

That's what I thought, except when I paid Nayol Wat, my mission log stated I was on the (4/6) step of main mission which said something to the effect of "Completion of this step is required for you Hull Upgrade. Please see the Tiberius shipyards in Primus for your reward." So I figured I was done, but the shipyards wouldn't talk to me.

[nimr0dbbow[IS]]

Strange,

Ionnoj Doesn't feature in the Level 100 HU.

I think it's a introduction left over from just before the Level 30 that is kicking in.

I'll have a look xx fingers.

You have to keep the autorization form in your cargo all the time while doing the options.

-----------

Think it may be this little mission:

Tiberius Shipyards - open for business! [Version 1.1.-]

It was put in just to let people know at level 30 go to Ionnoj and end their Hull upgrades on the shipyard. However, I may consider the reverse, where you go to the Shipyard to trigger the upgrade, do the options, speak to kerr and then return to the Shipyard to complete the upgrade.

This seems far more believable as you will be instigating the hull upgrade on visiting the shipyard. I've modified the above mission to keep you away from the Shipyard. (Sends you to the net-7 beacon instead, so if it is this mission interfereing then version 1.1 will show)

I think if 2 missions are present that send you to the same place, only 1 text tree shows up at whatever stage. I'll mention this again to devs.

[blattu]

wow this is an intresting thread......

(glad im a terran )

Edited May 5, 2010 by Blattu

[dcwestby]

Yeah Blattu, I'm certainly glad that I prefer Jenq, but I am trying progen.. Its fun for a diversion, sometimes, I wouldnt mind this sort of inventiveness for jenqs either really. As it would really improve things for those playing jenqs... but hey, thats an entirely different area.. and this is progen territory, so yeah, whatever happens, happens. I'm just glad to see a dev being very interactive with the rest of us.

Very good job with what you're doing. Keep it up whenever possible, you are doing a tremendous job.

[blattu]

yes dont get me wrong,

these missions are better than the usual run here/get that terranstyle mission.

i hope the terran dev will come up with something like these

(just not so diabolic)

[nimr0dbbow[IS]]

Remember:

All the module based (option) hull upgrades will have a form detailing the options. However, do not work on screenshots as the form will be updated in future when some options no longer reflect the storyline

[seekeronos]

yes dont get me wrong,

these missions are better than the usual run here/get that terranstyle mission.

i hope the terran dev will come up with something like these

(just not so diabolic)

If and when a certain TS that resembles me were ever to be appointed a content dev for terrans... I'm certain that certain TS would give Byakhee a run for his money for coming up with evil missions

[Lot]

I've just completed the HU100 missions.

Was I supposed to speak to the Agrippa NPCs during the HU100 missions and before the last 33% is done?

Because they won't speak to me now.

[Kherana]

With agrippa technology only being in the progen area how will this impact the other races in the future?

I retired my PS in ST3 due to the direction missions were taking. I feel like there's a "carrot on a stick" to build/play my character according to the direction the missions take. I explore, mine, and am not so in to combat, where will this leave me as far as "spec'g" the way I like to play vs "spec'g" to fulfill mission requirements; whether I play a PS/PP/PW?

The terran and jenquai missions are getting closer to what they were in live; will there be more movement in that direction with the progen as well? Or are there plans to take them in a different direction?