Algaron

Well now you're talkin' No I agree with you. When the big day comes, there will be the inevitable drop off in the Player base. I don't think it will quite as dire as you predict however. People will understand this one will probably be the last one, and the game development has made great strides in coming close to what we expect and remember from Live. Who knows, perhaps they will let us keep 1 L150 too as well, so I suspect the exodus may be more like a trickle. However I don't agree with your assessment that people will rush to complete 150 just to get into PvP. I wouldn't mind doing PvP when I hit L150, but I have lots of other things that I would want to do before I crossed that bridge. I look at it in the same light as getting faction for Blackbeard's Wake. Players that rushed to get faction for BBW, will surely own all the drones and ores in the sector for a brief period of time, but that will even out over time. No one will be able to enter BBW for the first little while because no one has the faction to get in (save for rd faction bug). Does that make BBW any less viable because no one is using the sector at that moment? I don't think it makes the sector less viable or attractive because no one is there. It is available content, ready to use when the players are. I also don't agree that ALL other content needs to be finished before implementing the PvP option. As far as straight up content or coding is concerned, there would be a lot less work to code a command to activate PvP [/pvp on:off], or to dust off the Arena and plop it back in Slayton. The work will be in creating the NPC to run the event and designing the PvP only devices for rewards. PvP will not be on the top of the list for content waiting to be implemented either, so I think your concerns about owning the Arena are unfounded. I tried to address the issue you had with noobs leaving the start sector and getting ganked, by suggesting players needed to be 150. That players needed to activate PvP before they could engage in PvP. That's both players btw - I cant attack you if you aren't flagged as well. I have also pointed out that there should be in essence 2 ways to PvP. The Arena, where players may duel or form a group, and fight for rewards and the rest of the Universe. I see it his way. First we have open sector PvP. There will be no need to create a separate extra closed sector just for PvP, and all of the coding required to create the sector with mobs and navs and other objects or assets. I disagree with those who feel it needs to be a closed sector. The Universe at large would be the playing field for PvP. This would lend itself to mobs (which are already in place) attacking PvPer's while in battle adding to the fun. Also the added benefit for PvE players to grab a beverage and popcorn and watch the battle ensue. Something that can not be done via a closed system. I have mentioned this all before but is worth repeating. Certain conditions and rules must be met before anyone can PvP in an open sector. 1. Players needs to be L150. (There will be no situation where a CL50 toon will ever be able to attack a lower level player) 2. All players must enable PvP to be in PvP mode. (Players will not be forced into participating in PvP, it's at the Players discretion) 3. Disengaging PvP will trigger a cooldown timer. I have suggested 5-30mins, once PvP is disengaged it can not be activated again until the cooldown completes. (Players will not be able to attack other players and then switch off their flag to avoid retribution.) 4. No damage to equipment or XP debt will be incurred because of a loss in a PvP battle. The Arena on the other hand would be where organized battles would happen. 1. PvP flags could be disabled when entering the Arena and activated when the battle begins. (I can't remember how this was handled in Live, I only suggest this to avoid the unscrupulous player who decides they can't wait until everyone is ready to begin.) 2. A Pick list in the Arena NPC's talk tree will enable groups to choose between group setup. 1v1, 2v2, or a full group of 6v6. Rewards would be commensurate with group size. I would suggest a choice of either a cash reward or some kind of token currency to purchase PvP Items. 3. The battles could be a timed event perhaps, lasting only a certain length of time before the event is declared a draw and PvP is disabled. 4. Tournaments could be set up in the future to allow for Guild v Guild battles. 5. When other tags are implemented, they could be used to indicate PvP achievements - eg. 10 battles in a row with out losing would award the player the [Ironman] tag, or could be level and rank based on your wins. So much potential for this in the future, and would make PvP attractive to a wider player base. I don't suggest we fire up the Arena tomorrow, however, I think regular open sector PvP could be implemented without a great deal of trouble, as there would be no content to add immediately, just coding to enable players to fight each other. (PvP items could be added later, and some already exist. I think Phorlaug was championing PvP items) Again I must reiterate, there should be NO impact on the rest of the EnB community at all. It will work like any other high level content in the game. If you decide to do Fishbowl, your decision won't affect my game play in the least.

That sounds pretty apocalyptical. Let's say for the sake of argument, that on the next server restart the devs had decided to open up the arena in Slayton, and that there was now an option to PvP via the flagging system. You can now use the slash command: [b]/pvp on [/b]to turn on PvP since it is[b] off [/b]by default. You learn that you need be a Level 150 toon in order to activate PvP. Could you activate PvP? Would you activate PvP? Or would you carry on as you normally would. Perhaps you aren't into PvP and just as soon not bother with it. How would your game be affected by not turning on the PvP flag? I played on a PvP server for 7 years, and I must say, it may have lost some newness sure. It was an integral part of the game. But it never lost it's excitement knowing that at any moment some player was going to come running at me with wild eyes! It was fight or flight and that's what made it fun. There were times when while engaged in PvP battle, a mob would show up and start working one of us over, or my opponent's buddy would suddenly appear from nowhere. It was unfortunate if I ran into a party that was bent on destruction. Of course, there were times when I didn't want all that fun and excitement, so I disabled PvP and forgot about it. There was no emotion attached. Here is the thing. What harm would come to player that decided not to join ? How would his game be any different than yesterday, or last week? Mobs will still act the same, ores will still be in the same spot. You still have to travel thru Dahin to get to Antares. You may notice a couple of players duking it out over there, but that's no concern to you. There could be so much potential for PvP, from reputation, rewards, cash or xp to new devices, tags, tournaments, glory! I don't think the PvP community wants to have PvP to keep up with the Jones. It has more to do with it being a fun element of some MMO's. If you could share your concerns about our missing boat and what solution you may have, that would be great.

To solve that issue. Only L150 players can PvP. I don't think we need to have equipment damaged or xp debt either. It would be bad enough you got your butt handed to you - why add insult to injury. I think the best way is that in the normal universe, a message would be displayed server wide. "Algaron has defeated Mimir. All hail Algaron!" or some such thing. And if you feel to need to vanquish my toon you can group up with another PW and challenge me in the Arena. Here you can choose to have money as your reward or accept points or tokens towards purchasing a PvP device - which would be NM/NT and unique with the PvP Only restriction. Perhaps a tag would be added ranking PvP players next to your guild tag. I can see lots of potential for PvP players that wouldn't affect the general community at all, but still give those players who enjoy testing their skills against another player the opportunity to do so.

Well just to add another point. There could be ways to set PvP with even more restrictions. Say for example you need to be L150 before you could set the flag. Personally I wouldnt want to be flying around trying to level up and have some awesome JD sneak up and unload all his beams on me. I just think it wouldn't be a difficult thing to do set up for those who enjoy matching their skills against another player. Creating a new sector just for PvP is an option but I don't believe it would be necessary. I harken back to WoW where I have watched a rogue decimate a mage, and then watched another mage school a rogue. Its all about how one plays the class. Mind you if your PS is getting chewed up fighting a PW or JD, group with another player and teach those warriors a lesson.

well one if you are a noob exiting the starting sector and you turn on pvp flag you deserve to smacked. That's the silliest thing I have ever heard. It wouldn't happen at all so don't be going there. I gather you arent interested in playing PvP. So don't. Like I said if you want PvP play it - if you don't want PvP don't bother with it - it will not affect you in the least. Leave the flag off and continue on as you normally would. I said 'owning another player is it's own reward" I didn't say it was the only reward. I suggested that the Arena be used to issue rewards as in cash or points used to buy PvP gear. The point of PvP is to test yourself against another player. If I was a PS and saw a PW coming at me and I didn't think I would 'have a snowball's chance', I would get my toon out of there. Mind you it is meant to test you skills against another toon. I would love to take my JD out against a PW to see how I faired. Thats the fun part about it. If I owned a PS I would try to see how I faired against a TE. Each class has skills and PvP is a great way to test yourself against something that wasnt coded with some AI, but was unpredictable. Anyways like I said before - PvP could be set up that would have no impact on the rest of the PVE community. As for polls, I doubt that would shed any light on the subject -if you are a PvP hater nothing will change your mind and yet having PvP via the flag option wouldnt affect you in the least so why bother having your opinion on the matter.

Exactly Vitaes, I would go so far as to suggest you don't even need to create a sector for PvP. Just flip the switch [ /pvp on] and you're playing pvp. The only sector needed is already coded with the Arena. It just needs to be implemented. It already exists. I dont understand these Negative Nellies and their opposition to PvP. If you don't want to play PvP... don't. And Mimir, I don't know what point you think I made for you. Could you explain?

Well I don't forsee the scenario you all talked about. I agree that the best way is to combine PvP/PvE on one server. It is the simplest to implement and the least amount of coding. I[b] do not[/b] agree with your idea that it would be to easy to take a shot at a player and turn off the flag the avoid retribution. As I have already stated, there would be a timer, in which PvP would still be active even after turning off your Flag, for a period of time. 5 minutes or 30 minutes - there would be a cooldown timer where you simply wouldn't be able to do what you envision, unless of course you /quit. Quitting while tagged PvP would register an immediate loss in your win/loss count. PvP should be it's own reward, and bragging rights is for the vain. However, if you need your ego assuaged, a simple server wide message would be displayed stating "Player X has defeated Player Y most brutally!". As well rewards obtained thru PvP could only be used for PvP. There would be no 'uber' gear you could take into Fishbowl for example. It doesn't 'suck' Mimir, that you don't get uber gear for raids. That isnt the point of PvP. The point of PvP isn't to get uber gear you could use in any other raid. The point of PvP is just that - to PvP, and the reward is the satisfaction of owing another toon. The rewards could be handled via the Arena NPC - either a one time win resulting in a cash reward, or a turn-in of points to purchase any PvP gear. There shouldn't be any damage to equipment during PvP. As for grieving and ganking, my goodness , its PVP for pete's sake. If you don't want to get ganked... don't PvP!?! Of course the strong will pick on the weak! There [b]will not[/b] be a 'mass exodus' from EnB or 'rage quitting', perhaps the player will leave PvP with his tail between his legs, but to quit the game because you got owned by another player? I don't think so. PvP is totally self inflicted, so if you have rage because of it... well uh turn off PvP and don't play it anymore. It's a pretty simple concept really. For the majority of players you will not even notice there is PvP going on. The only people affected by having PvP on the Play server is those who choose to PvP period. Items would be tagged as 'PvP Only', meaning you need to have yourself flagged before you could even install any of the devices, or if already installed and you turn off the flag, the device deactivates. I have played on PvP servers a lot in other games. For example in Warcraft my cloth armored mage was ganked relentlessly by rogues with their sap / backstab. I didn't quit because I got owned, for I CHOSE to play that way. I did moan and pout because I got owned, I did turn off my PvP flag occasionally, but I never quit the game because of it.

[quote name='Phorlaug' timestamp='1336554082' post='57535'] I'll add to what you suggest. There should not be a slash command for PvP, to have the option to turn it on and off at will even when being attacked and loosing. Not the escape we want. [/quote] Well actually in WoW you couldn't deflag yourself to avoid being attacked. You could turn off the PvP flag but it would still remain active for 5 minutes. This avoids the scenario you suggest. The slash command is the best and easiest way to flag yourself for PvP. I would highly recommend not adding devices or items that you need to haul around to activate PvP. This just adds more code needlessly - not to mention it takes up precious cargo space. With a PvP flag, there would be no need to create a separate sector just for PvP as it would be Universe wide.Those players who wish to PvP could only attack other players who have tagged themselves for PvP - everyone else would be PvE and not affected at all. They couldn't be ganked by a PvP player and would appear like any other player in the game. Only flagged PvP players would be able to see other PvP players. Now, there could also be the Arena where you would need to be flagged to enter. As this was already incorperated (but turned off atm) in sectors like Slayton, It shouldn't take much coding to implement the Arena in Slayton again. (I hope!) My suggestion for Arena battles was to have a NPC inside the Arena where you could set 1vs1, 2vs2, or 6vs6 battles. The group leader of each side would talk to the npc, set the battle group size, and click ready. Once both group leaders were ready, a timer of say 30 sec or 1 min would start. Players could not attack each other until the countdown had finished. So upon entering the Arena player would not be able to attack until everyone was ready.

There are a couple ways to look at PvP in EnB. Taking a page out of World of Warcraft, it would be possible to set up a PVE and a PVP server. Everyone logging into a PvP server in WoW knew that they could be attacked by an opposing Horde or Alliance toon at any time, save for Sanctuaries like Dalaran (you were unable to attack in these areas). The whole world was a PvP zone, so players could kill or be killed almost anywhere. On a PvE server you couldnt attack or be killed regardless. If you want to set your toon to PvP it would be a simple matter of using a slash command - something like /pvp [on/off]. An option would be to make the whole Universe a PvP zone but in order to PvP you had to flag yourself as a PvP player. Players who didnt have their flag set could not attack or be attacked by other players. I think flagging would be by far the simplest solution, as there would be no need to have special areas. Anyone who didn't want to PvP would not have their game changed in the least. Except perhaps seeing another player with a special tag or colour signifying they are a PvP toon. An Arena something like in live could used to hold Death matches 2vs2, 3vs3 or 6vs6. Now to make it fun! Setting up a system where certain achievements would grant special rewards. Say you killed 20 other toons without dying - you would receive a token to turn in for an awesome device that could only be obtained via this system. (Make it NT/NM) Perhaps it would take 10 tokens to get this device, and the device could be only used in the Arena, or a device that could be used only on PvP players, or a server wide message alerting the universe of how cool you are, when you kill 50 in a row without dying. Maybe you get a tag as well for certain achievements. (I am a big fan of achievements and server wide messages based on accomplishments of a player). I think PvP could be incorperated in the existing universe without the need of having to create a separate sector, or disrupting the rest of the community.

Awesome pics. Not only are there 2 chairs but 4! They are hard to see unless you hold down the CTRL key while using you mouse to pan around. Unfortunately the view springs back to center once it hits the edge of the FOV. Yah it would be sweet if we could use that door, if only to check on the cargo. Maybe smack around some deviant diplomats who get outta line with all that whining.

The second chair has always been there I am pretty sure - it's all on ships not just Terran. While in First person view on my JD I can see the chair in front of the Captains chair if I press 'I' for Inv or 'U' or 'Y' to bring up the missions.. 'I' will show you the view from the left of the Capt's chair and 'U' will show you the view from the right - bringing up the map will actually seat you in the second chair which is directly in front of the Captains chair . There is only one vacant chair in front of the captains chair, just different angles of the same chair. You may notice the terminals which display the Inv or Missions waiting to be accessed. I would absolutely love to be able to walk around inside my ship.

My vote is for Ascendant Voltoi in Dahin. Ahh I remember the long hours of camping the Philosopher. Good times. Seems like it would be an easy event to add, but I could be wrong. High level content and I don't think it had a story line to it - but that was years ago.

Many apologies then. I didn't think I was being adversarial just curious. To any I have offended, gosh I am sorry. I won't mention this again and will not bring it up again.

Well its kind of my point about this. You love to play the progen class- you are intimately familiar with the race and each class. IMHO don't you think you would be logical choice to work on Progen development? Why would I feel comfortable talking to a TE about what is wrong with my cloak or a Progen about what is wrong with my summon or fold space? Pretty hard to understand the class if you don't even play one? Doesn't that make sense at all? I have never played a progen ever - not live and not here. I wouldn't have the first clue as to what is wrong with the race/class. Nor would I attempt to tell a Progen or post about progens skills telling them this needs to be nerfed or that has to be nerfed. And yet most every post I have seen concerning Jenquai and cloak or some such skill inevitably has some terran telling me that cloak needs to be nerfed.

Wow I get a negative response for my opinion? Whatever. You didn't even have the nerve to post why you feel that way. Are you a Terran?Come on what is wrong with you? Seriously I don't get some of the people that post here. It's an observation, I see lots of terran developers to work on Terrans. But no developers working on Jenquai concerns, no one for the jenquai community to ask questions or have input into that race/class. If I am wrong, a pox on my house.

Are you recruiting more devs to develop Jenquai? I understand this is just for storyline development? However I noticed we have 3 lead developers for each race. Kyp (terran) Kenu (jenquai) and Byahkee (progen). Terrans have 2 more developers Curis and Vitaes. There doesnt appear to be any help for Kenu or Byahkee. Are terrans that much harder to figure out? Nothing against Curis but he shows he has 3 toons all progens and he is listed as a terran developer. Just a thought but wouldnt it be prudent to have developers with a 150 toon of the class/race they are trying to help develop?

EA also had working classes for those who wanted to play Original classes. We don't have that yet. They don't have time to fix my favourite class now - why should I be happy if you like your Privateer.Give me a break. If I had a working JD I could care less if they had 21 classes. The game isnt even close to being better than the original. Unless of course if you are progen. Start with a baseline of 6 completely working original classes. Then you have all the time and resources to decide (yes still deciding on how to make these 3 classes) on how to use the limited resources available. As it is now - lets steal this skillset from the JE and give it to this TS. Community input be damned. Just sayin..

+1 Paul. Totally agree with this assessment. The original classes aren't anywhere near like they were in live. All the devs time and resources seem to be going into trying to develop extra classes while the original classes have been getting piecemeal fixes. Cloak is still a huge issue that hasnt been addressed properly. Group cloak/CC in group is still not functioning, if a JE pulls out of cloak it wipes out all jenquai cloaks. It shouldnt be a fact that creating the new classes means nerfing the original classes. Navigate in Grav Well for one, as it's useless on the JE who used to be able to zip thru grav wells in live no problem. Now its a futile exercise. I feel you will lose more of your player base messing with the original classes, than not providing a new class. If I was a player from Live coming back to this EMU, I would create a toon I played in Live first. If that toon isn't working and 15 patches later, it's still not working correctly, what expectations would I have that any of the suggestions put forth from the community will be looked at.

Whatever skill you decide for the JD , you must make sure that it is fairly useless, uses lots of energy, and leaves the JD incapable of defending itself so that the class will die quickly. You know in keeping in line with current skill set. They mustn't be able to kill lvl 60 mobs solo, and should only be used to RTB other classes.

Yes I have found that while flying thru space all cloaked up on my JE, I will see an ore field which I wish to mine. So i pull up to a roid and start to mine when wouldn't you know - I get a message saying "Cannot mine while hidden". Wouldn't it be great if I could just start mining and my ship would uncloak all by itself and actually start mining without the error message? Not really sure what the purpose of the not allowing the ship to uncloak automatically? Is it just down to the fact it's unfinished code and this was the easiest way to handle it?

I believe in Live, using a skill would override some skills while other skills could be used concurrently. Take Cloak for example. Back in the day, a JD could be cloaked and the be able to use Summon (breaking the cloak) or Fold Space or cast PSI Shield, without having to first go through the process of first having to cancel the skill, then activating another skill. Each active skill could be cast regardless of whether or not another skill was already in place. It was also easy enough to cancel the activation of one skill, say summoning by simply applying another skill like Fold Space in its place. This also avoided accidently double tapping a skill and cancelling it prematurely. Many times because of a crappy keyboard or faulty mouse I have double tapped Cloak only to find out I am not really cloaking but am still nekked, because I inadvertently hit the skill twice. Hitting Cloak for example once twice or thrice didn't matter at all as the skill would complete the cycle based on the first activation of the skill. Once fully activated, hitting cloak again would deactivate or using another skill like Fold Space would deactivate Cloak and start the FS cycle. Fold Space, Summon, Render Energy could be cancelled by hitting the skill again or starting the cycle of another skill. Cloak, PSI and Repair were the exception as it had to complete the cycle before being able to use another skill or cloak again to deactivate. Repair could be used while cloaked as well. I would suggest that any skill that requires a minimum cycle time like cloak or PSI should only be cancelled by using another skill. Device activation should be independant of activation skills as it is now. It would be real awesome if we could get rid of "Another skill is active" thing. It really takes away from the enjoyability of the class I find, and isnt that the reason we all play this game? To have fun?

Well with a JD only having 4 devices slots I would need to swap in a lepus or another new device the Devs will create. That would mean keeping in my GreaseMonkey 9 limiting me to only 3 usable devices slots. (Mind you I rarely take out my GM9 at any rate) So hopefully devs will create a reactor or beam I could use instead of making yet another device I would need to use. A new device would be fine for a 6 slot JE but not so great for JDs. And thats just for the Fold Space range, not even considering increase in Summon. I still think just adding more range to the skills would be the best option.

Correct. Not much choice to increase fold space range (not to mention increase summon range for a JD), so back to my original suggestion of increasing the actual skill range for all Jenquai in lieu of creating a completely new equipment line.

Well I was actually referring to Teleport Self which all Jenquai get which would benefit your JE/JS. There is no direction on Teleport Self tho and Directional Teleport is also only useful to High level JDs not lower level JDs without it and who would benefit the most from a greater fold space distance. Yes perhaps going the route of better equip buffs and not modding the Skill would be acceptable. However there really isnt much choice for a Max JE - the only real option is an Europa 9 reactor. But even a Lepus 9 only gives around 1k extra range. Even turning 180 using Area Teleport on the group with a Lepus 9 would get my group 7-8k away from Ten-Gu in Fish Bowl - and those mobs don't stop chasing you. So Fold 3 times and Summon group. By that time the rest of your group are dead.

I was wondering if we could double the actual range for max fold space and summon enemy from 6.5k to 13k or 15k. The reason for this request is pretty simple as fold space is used to escape damage from a mob when being overwhelmed. Most notably once your PSI shield has failed and you need to get out of range of mobs to recast PSI shield, or recharge reactor. Folding only 6.5k doesn't necessarily mean you fold 6.5k away from a mob. For example a mob is 2.5k away from you - you use fold space and it plops you 4k away from the mob. That still leaves you within range of beams, ml or pl of most high level mobs. Fold space should be able to teleport you far enough away to escape damage. It would be most helpful in a group doing a raid when things go bad, the JD could fold away and use summon friendly group to pull everyone to safety, regroup and heal, and go back at the mob. As it is now - 6.5k will not get you out of danger. Even using Area Teleport will not get the entire group out of danger. I know these were the values in Live but as I have been told many times. This isnt live So let's make Fold Space actually useful. I would like to hear from hard core JDs on what they think - none of you part time ten'shao with a PW main either