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To the devs raguarding particular guilds


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I'm here to speak about specific guilds . That utterly control the content to a point they may as well own the game at the end game people are given no opportunity's to enter raids unless given permission by certain guilds . The camping issue if you attempt to go near a spot they are camping one of the 3 bug builds do so at your own peril . they will kill everything u fire at take every single kill too a point your only way of staying their is attempting to ks them and if you dare to try and hold your own at the nav 3 will turn into 4 then 5 till they have enough people to ensure you cannot get a single kill . And force you off the nav if you dare to say anything point out what they are doing is wrong you will get a load of verbal abuse on public channels . So what I really want to know is are we handing the game to them because it seems as time go's on their getting more and more control . Something needs to be done quickly this isn't acceptable behaviour nobody shod control any content let alone a large majority of it . If it isn't stopped your sending out a message join the big 3 or quit .

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you said you were here to speak about specific guilds but you mentioned none.

you gave no information on what happened,who was involved or when,along with no screenshots at all.

and your  registered e-mail  shows 5 level 0 avatars.

if you want input from the developers you have to provide something  of substance other then just a post wich is open ended and void of details.

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I thought the raid point made it pretty obvious . Since the 3 guilds in almost complete control of the raids are

1) B/I

2) static

3)VGE

 

on the abuse note mainly

VGE and static with a few in builders.

 

and these particular guilds will force you into a position where you have to leave navs or feel you have to kill steal to hold your foothold their because if they cant kill steal you more and more people turn up till they have complete control of the nav as I said you say anything you get abuse. I don't have screenshots but seriously rules need to come in the big 3 need to be put in line . They have too much power its wrong . Unless this game's aim is join 3 guilds or spend your time being kill stole so u cant get decent items forced off spots begging your way into raids or quit.

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Ok, so why not form a fourth guild with like opinions to yourself? Surely there are people enough out there.

 

The development staff will never interfere in internal guild type stuff unless we find them to be exploiting something.

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Hm everyone's either leaving playing extremely casual or joining the big 3. Their isn't room for a fourth handing the largest majority of control to the big 3 meaning if you go near a nav they want they send 3 groups at it I have had this numerous time's they control said nav your forced to leave people will only put up with that so long before quitting.

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Okay, I'll bite.

There is a lot more to this game, and any game really, than end game raiding.

If, for you, End Game content is what makes a game worth playing, perhaps you are looking in the wrong place. Earth and Beyond Emulator is not only not finished yet (though stable and usable by virtually anyone), it is based around a game that has a lot of content just to explore and seek stuff.

So, you don't get the chance for Zet drops right off the bat. Big deal. Let the "big guilds" have their fun, members will get bored and move on to other things, which will open up opportunity for you.

Or, perhaps, you can find enough frustrated players and forge a solid alliance "read Guild" with them to level the playing field.

 

So, the big three want to watch you prove you can down a boss so they don't step in and take it? Last I checked that was still Kill Stealing, unless you give them permission. And no, you're not giving them permission just by attempting raids. Read between the lines on this :)

 

This will be my only input here.

Until next time, keep up the good work EnB Dev crew.

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Ha....  I believe we (Epic Gamers) are fourth.  A slow process getting to the fourth (1.5 years), but rewarding.

Took lots of days, weeks, months with just me and 3 other guildies representing Epic.  Now we have lots of regular players.

 

We started doing Mordonna raids about 5 months ago, and now doing the Fish Bowl, just about every weekend.

For the FB raid, we do reach out to non-guild members to fill opening in our formations. 

At this point, we are working on figuring out the requirements of the other raids. 

 

On the topic of regular Navs, I have to ask you first......What did you do during LIVE?

I remember 3,4,5 groups of 6 at all the popular navs, in LIVE.

And, as in life, the best group won.  I don't agree with being called out, in any channel, but ppl will be ppl.

In regards to encroaching on a nav being hunted.  There are days the LIVE challenge happens

and we call our guildies for help at a nav.  One benefit of joining or forming a guild, backup.

But you have to develop the guild.  It's not gonna be raid ready for a bit.

 

Another question I have for you Wireclub ( lol, 5 zero lvl toons).

What would you recommend happen at these navs or in the game, to reduce you getting out shot?

 

And the last question I have is......How many are in your guild?

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By all means post screen shots and full un-edited chat logs. We try to police ourselves.

 

We are not out to force folks off a nav, however there have been some times when a person was at a nav and started being an asshat, and general tomfoolery in local which prompts guildies to band together to insure they get the kills. Most of the guilds here would likely do the same.

 

Have the courage to post with your main also, it would certainly carry more weight when leveling accusations. ;)

 

As to the raid control thing... the big 3 do not control any raids. The reason the big 3 do them alot is because they can. The schedule setup between the big 3 is to prevent conflicts between the big 3, it does not affect anyone else.

 

Edited to add info

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Sooooooooooo if anyone is camping at a nav before Wireclub gets there they are supposed to move on so he can camp it ? Yes ok i think that makes perfect sense :)

 

On a serious note though , if ANYONE is at a nav and someone else comes along and bullies them off it . I advise you politly ask them not to , whilst taking screenshots so it can be dealt with .

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By all means post screen shots and full un-edited chat logs. We try to police ourselves.

 

We are not out to force folks off a nav, however there have been some times when a person was at a nav and started being an asshat, and general tomfoolery in local which prompts guildies to band together to insure they get the kills. Most of the guilds here would likely do the same.

 

Have the courage to post with your main also, it would certainly carry more weight when leveling accusations. ;)

 

As to the raid control thing... the big 3 do not control any raids. The reason the big 3 do them alot is because they can. The schedule setup between the big 3 is to prevent conflicts between the big 3, it does not affect anyone else.

 

Edited to add info

 

I've been playing this game for a little while now and I've found that having a discussion with someone in game is generally a more productive avenue than a rant.  Not that I don't enjoy a good rant, haven't let one loose myself, but a rant will elicit the response that you have seen in this thread.

 

In general, you are correct.  The end-game content requires you to join a guild and do the camping/farming for items.  It can get frustrating when your mob gets killed by another player (damn JDs and their cloak), but usually a word with them will correct the behavior.  If they continue it, contact a guild officer.  If it is still not addressed, then by all means rant away and give specifics.  No one likes to have their boorish behavior aired in public and be humiliated by the community for being a world class person.

 

 

Edit:

Oh, and for the record, its ALWAYS Bell's fault.

Edited by Blacklung
prick is un acceptable
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   I read all this.....Feels like WOW....sad...all of you.
     Sad....

If we dont get a long it will be gone...
 
 

I think there are a few people who feel strongly that guilds have a strong hold on all of the upper level eq and hunting spots...

 

It stands to reason, the big guilds have a lot of people, some of whom are very well setup for raiding and super-uber solo playing... They camp things and others feel out gunned...

 

Now we've all had the odd incident where people jump into a spawn we've been camping, or arrived at a popular spot and gotten started just to find out someone just ran to get ammo and came back, or something.  In most, if not all, of these cases a quick discussion can lead to a resolution...

 

Guilds are organized, they have goals and ambitions, it is all about resources and sharing/hoarding in equal measure...

 

I dislike guilds, but not for those reasons.. I just can't stand the internal politics and being forced in some cases to deal with people I'd rather not... So I solo play...

 

Hours upon hours upon hours of me messing around with my toons and my in game projects keeps me quite happy... I have friends that are in guilds and even some guild leaders that have helped me out from time to time with things I can't do with out a guild... there are ways to find plenty of Post 150 things to do without raids and without the super-uber equipment... Yeah I'd love to have a GoD beam on all of my Jennies.. but for what I do it is just a "Would be nice" since I don't raid I don't need that extra 10% damage output...

 

It is all about perspective.. The solo player game is different than the small guild game and that is still different from the Big Guild game... Playing solo and thinking like a big guild raider will lead you to feel unsatisfied... You want the raid goodies, you want all that.. join a guild that raids.. and with that you have to accept the guild and all its glory/headaches... it is the price you pay for all the toys...

Edited by Liucee
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I witnessed a event last week on general chat, i stepped up and asked if a dev /gm was on and reading this,(on general chat),i remember wireclub calling the guild out for k/sing him ,which they admitted too in general chat,however it proceeded to a lot of abuse thrown at wireclub, none of which was game related...etc grow up/get your diaper changed, and a "i bet he aint english"...wireclub in fairness kept his tetalliation to simple attacks on them ksing him, he did not stoop to personal attack....eventualy a gm/dev came on and took it to pm....my point is? yes something needs sorting before it gets more out of controll,

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I witnessed a event last week on general chat, i stepped up and asked if a dev /gm was on and reading this,(on general chat),i remember wireclub calling the guild out for k/sing him ,which they admitted too in general chat,however it proceeded to a lot of abuse thrown at wireclub, none of which was game related...etc grow up/get your diaper changed, and a "i bet he aint english"...wireclub in fairness kept his tetalliation to simple attacks on them ksing him, he did not stoop to personal attack....eventualy a gm/dev came on and took it to pm....my point is? yes something needs sorting before it gets more out of controll,

Taking these kinds of issues to public channels for more than an initial complaint is more of a detriment to the game than the suspected KS offense.  There are ways in game to handle abuse and problems via the help system.  Screenshots, posted or PMed to a GM via this forum is also a viable option.

 

Continued and incessant argument and complaint on a public channel to which the offending party is probably not listening to, ignoring or getting their rocks off because that is how trolls and griefers operate, is not going to help anyone and causes a general feeling of negativity toward the person making the complaint.  It is just not a good idea.  Yes, we all have to vent, I am not saying a gripe now and then is out of line.  But having fights in public channels, especially New Players or Market channels is bad for everyone.  New or returning players may get the sense that this is acceptable and either quit playing or repeat this poor behavior.

 

Gripes -> General -> Forum -> GM/HGM via PM or Forum PM.

 

If the offender is in a guild you may want to request a discussion with a guild leader/officer.  Often they will intervene because they don't want their guild associated with that kind of thing.  When I've had problems with specific people from a guild I always inquire around and find out who runs the guild.  I get two things from this... The person offending gets a talking to and if I am polite, articulate and not a general pain the butt, the guild leader may even become someone I can call upon for other things later on. 

 

There are mature, generally adult ways to handle these issues.  Most of the people playing EnB EMU are adults, most of us well into our 30s and 40s.  If you approach a problem with a cool head, maturity and good manners you will often find it comes out very well in the end. 

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These are some nice posts Liucee and i agree with a lot you say.

Wireclub tries to paint a picture here for whatever reasons but the truth is most of us are old enough to handle things in a calm and mature way.

We strive to avoid conflict, in fact thats what the whole rotation system is about, and we certainly don't deny content from any other player.

We included a player from EpicGamers guild into our BBG raid tonight with all the obligations and privileges it contains, just saying.

 

Most of us played the game in the original period of 2002-2004, know the ins and outs and we certainly know how friendly this community is and i personally think thats the major reason most of us are here again.

 

Ofcourse there are clashes between us from time to time but nothing a good nights sleep wont fix because this is a game after all and meant for our enjoyment.

When i come upon a nav that another player/group is already hunting i turn tail and find something else to do while i wait for the spot to become available.

I have received the same courtesy from others and i even send a pm informing them that they can come back to what they had originally planed when i'm done.

I even have engaged to a friendly competition from time to time as to see who will kill faster the intended victim and i have certainly apologized if i made a mistake while hunting.

 

Now hear at this story wireclub.

Someone comes to a nav where a guild member of mine is already hunting and starts verbally abusing him to the point where he will leave to preserve his peace of mind, against my better judgment.

So ofcourse after my guildmate takes the high road, the boss spawns and the offending player gets the kill all while bragging about it in local chat..

How would you respond to this kind of behavior?

As a rule of life i treat people the way i would like to be treated and that is not a person that commands my respect.

 

Its almost as funny the person that gave away in market the "extremely privileged" information of desash in cooper and the voltoi boss in antares dropping some very sought after loot, isn't it?  :lol:

 

This is an MMO game and believe it or not there is content that demands players to team up, be it a guild or just friends helping each other, in order to tackle it.

Limitations arise from solo play make no mistake.

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I've been playing this game for a little while now and I've found that having a discussion with someone in game is generally a more productive avenue than a rant.  Not that I don't enjoy a good rant, haven't let one loose myself, but a rant will elicit the response that you have seen in this thread.

 

In general, you are correct.  The end-game content requires you to join a guild and do the camping/farming for items.  It can get frustrating when your mob gets killed by another player (damn JDs and their cloak), but usually a word with them will correct the behavior.  If they continue it, contact a guild officer.  If it is still not addressed, then by all means rant away and give specifics.  No one likes to have their boorish behavior aired in public and be humiliated by the community for being a world class person.

 

 

Edit:

Oh, and for the record, its ALWAYS Bell's fault.

I totaly think this is the way to go now.....good luck wireclub

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I find that most people in the Big 3 are rather helpful. Even the Big 3 have called upon a little help when short handed, and have no issue with an outside member joining a raid with them. I've been on raids with people from Builders and VGE. They even share loot. If you have a toon that can handle raid content, you might even get invited yourself. As for my guild (Epic Gamers), we have been more than happy to have outsiders fill out groups for raiding when needed. We have gotten to the point where we can field 2-3 full groups at the right times, but as Getoffme stated, it has been a long time coming.

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I cant tell you how many times im at a nav with a friend or two say killing fish waiting on desash to pop and had a solo player or another group come in. whem this happpens I'll tell him or them in local they are welcome to share mobs with us and the boss is FFA . Most of the time there is no problem . sometimes there is . I maybe alone in this but i dont feel anyone owns a nav. Happy to share. I also go to a nav that is being camped and asked if its ok to share and was welcomed. other times not so much.
To be honest last time there was a problem my guild and I were doing a Toda-o raid and the last boss kitted us to where desash spawns. We killed him there and while rolling on loot we were killing the 55's that were attacking us . We got blasted for that as KS'rs to no end . i can only imagine what would have been said id Desash chose that time to spawn
OMG Muhir is right, Its all my fault :)
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I think that the actual incidents of honest Griefing and or KSing are rare, guild or no guild... many times I could say it is an honest mistake or someone that is just not wanting to communicate to others in the area and work out a situation so they compete head to head... It is nearly always something that can be worked out.  I've have nearly come to the determination that KS complaints and Grief complaints are often just someone that WANTS to be offended and makes a stink over nothing..

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I think that the actual incidents of honest Griefing and or KSing are rare, guild or no guild... many times I could say it is an honest mistake or someone that is just not wanting to communicate to others in the area and work out a situation so they compete head to head... It is nearly always something that can be worked out.  I've have nearly come to the determination that KS complaints and Grief complaints are often just someone that WANTS to be offended and makes a stink over nothing..

This.

 

From an internal standpoint, a good 90 percent of the complaining about spawns/timers/drops/guilds/KSing/etc is just someone looking for any reason to pitch a fit. 

 

Very rarely does it pan out.  I could count on one hand the number of people ive heard of getting a ban or sanction for being a jerk in game.  One hand.

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