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If Pvp Were Added - How To Make It Fun For All

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[quote name='Phorlaug' timestamp='1327610018' post='52378']
Theres a PVP arena or Sector. (Boosss's and Hissss's)

[/quote]+1 this :D
Wanna pod me some trojens ..er progens. hah Edited by Dakynos

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[quote name='StarbuckJD' timestamp='1327613227' post='52381']
+1 this :D
Wanna pod me some trojens ..er progens. hah
[/quote]

Come at me bro.
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[quote name='StarbuckJD' timestamp='1327613227' post='52381']
+1 this :D
Wanna pod me some trojens ..er progens. hah
[/quote]

Oh i would LOVE to see a JD pod a PS.....well it would be interesting to see them TRY at least :)

Powerdown = untargetable....can't target it, can't shoot it, Imagine a PS with a L56 coma device, thats the effect they have on a JD targeting them...:)
Menace= 0 control or buffs for X amount of time...any decent PS can pod you in the time frame you are menaced, you run in fear from them and they shove ammo up your tailpipe while you do so :)

Cloak?....PvP cloak is defeatable via device and skill, just because you have gotten used to all mobs not detecting you up until now, don't mean its a auto "I-win" button in PvP. When it's emplimented fully in game correctly even certain mobs will see through it, and it will be interuptable, and dmg will still be allocated through it.

trust me..if they get PvP working like in live, there will be the same whinefests in forums as in live about PS being so..so..SO OP! Nerf them now! it's not fair! (grabs ball and stomps off home in a huff) :)

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[quote name='Mattsacre' timestamp='1327643923' post='52463']
Oh i would LOVE to see a JD pod a PS.....well it would be interesting to see them TRY at least :)

Powerdown = untargetable....can't target it, can't shoot it, Imagine a PS with a L56 coma device, thats the effect they have on a JD targeting them... :)
Menace= 0 control or buffs for X amount of time...any decent PS can pod you in the time frame you are menaced, you run in fear from them and they shove ammo up your tailpipe while you do so :)

Cloak?....PvP cloak is defeatable via device and skill, just because you have gotten used to all mobs not detecting you up until now, don't mean its a auto "I-win" button in PvP. When it's emplimented fully in game correctly even certain mobs will see through it, and it will be interuptable, and dmg will still be allocated through it.

trust me..if they get PvP working like in live, there will be the same whinefests in forums as in live about PS being so..so..SO OP! Nerf them now! it's not fair! (grabs ball and stomps off home in a huff) :)
[/quote]

I destroyed PS's in live. They have no HDC. 10 seconds, they are toasted. All I need, is 10 seconds.
All this stuff about powerdown and menace is silly when you cant overlap the skills and eliminate all time gaps. Besides, in PvP I am SURE there would be a chance of failure on offensive skills, just like there are on mob skills being interrupted.

The only threat to a PW is another PW with an EMP missile launcher

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[quote name='C Del' timestamp='1327647778' post='52471']

Thirdly, and perhaps most importantly, the PP will pwn at PvP; that's who I'd be worried about, not the PS.
[/quote]

My PP pwnz at PvP ... yes this meant to be dirty
XD

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[quote name='Mattsacre' timestamp='1327643923' post='52463']
trust me..if they get PvP working like in live, there will be the same whinefests in forums as in live about PS being so..so..SO OP! Nerf them now! it's not fair! (grabs ball and stomps off home in a huff) :)
[/quote]Then it wouldn't be working, would it? ;)
Don't really need to nerf anyone, just do as EVE does with pvp loadouts. Could even make it were pvm equipment does little to nothing in pvp (with resist mods). PvP equipment with skill resists and pvp equipment resist calculations for weapons. Just good old item based adjustment. And then to further balance the issue, it should be fleet conflict rather than 1v1 (though 1v1 possible). Guild vs. guild or what have you, along with group conflict scenarios etc. And out of sight, out of mind, to a few special areas, not open pvp anywhere, no one else effected. Could even make a dedicated pvp class, one from each race with a balanced skill set just for pvp and any pvp sector yard trash mobs, though a little more complicated compared to just making loadouts.

Maybe as development gets a little further along, we can start to seriously consider our options for it :) Edited by StarbuckJD

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[quote name='Ryle' timestamp='1327646543' post='52467']
I destroyed PS's in live. They have no HDC. 10 seconds, they are toasted. All I need, is 10 seconds.
All this stuff about powerdown and menace is silly when you cant overlap the skills and eliminate all time gaps. Besides, in PvP I am SURE there would be a chance of failure on offensive skills, just like there are on mob skills being interrupted.

The only threat to a PW is another PW with an EMP missile launcher
[/quote]

As someone who was on a PvP server for nine years, about 95% of the encounters I had were never one on one. Keep that in mind. If there ever is PvP, players will find a way to kill PW's.

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Just reposting from the other thread where we got way off topic. I saw some good ideas, so here is my last quoted post to keep it going

[quote name='Ryle' timestamp='1327698676' post='52536']
No doubt, ive pvped in many other games myself. The issue is that on EnB live, PvP was such a ridiculous joke. It was more times than not 1v1 in a little arena (basically a stylized duel in a little mini sector), and whoever had the most DPS/Defense (PW) would always win. There were no tactics, no real system. TE had a pretty good run at it too, but the poor jenquai, TT, and PS just got rocked hard. The game was never designed to pit JE vs PW. The PW is built to mow things down. Complete combat imbalance. Diverse class PvP never had a chance from just this standpoint.

Unfortunately I never saw any serious team fighting, though I am sure it was supported. I know multiple people could go in, and im sure two 6-man team of 2 TT a JE, a JD, and 2 PW/PS/TE each would be beast to fight against each other via mixing skills... but... PvP on andromeda was very very light at best. I was one of maybe... 10 people that did it regularly?

I could think of ways PvP in EnB EMU could be hysterically good, just put in something like the battlefield system of old SWG/battleground system of WoW, queue it up, team it up and rock it. Make a PvP sector for open world for those who want to solo/random skirmish/gank/etc. Keep 1v1 arenas for E-peeners and so on. But until classes are balanced against each other, 1v1 is just simply PW territory. It would take so much work to really even it out so PvP was all around fun outside of a team vs team system.

Yes I know I dont include the other three classes, ive never played them so I am entirely unfamiliar with what they can ever do outside of what ive see in the few times ive grouped with someone to kill mobs.
[/quote] Edited by Ryle

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The PT would do pretty well in PvP with some equipment support. L9 shields, L9 reactors, 5 guns, L5 crits, L5 Menace. The Scout & JT would not do well at all.

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Well a little bit technically:
[quote name='StarbuckJD' timestamp='1327695699' post='52527']
Don't really need to nerf anyone, just do as EVE does with pvp loadouts. Could even make it were pvm equipment does little to nothing in pvp (with resist mods). PvP equipment with skill resists and pvp equipment resist calculations for weapons. Just good old item based adjustment. And then to further balance the issue, it should be fleet conflict rather than 1v1 (though 1v1 possible). Guild vs. guild or what have you, along with group conflict scenarios etc. And out of sight, out of mind, to a few special areas, not open pvp anywhere, no one else effected. Could even make a dedicated pvp class, one from each race with a balanced skill set just for pvp and any pvp sector yard trash mobs, though a little more complicated compared to just making loadouts.
[/quote]
But yes, Ryle, matches as you explained have been on my mind as well. Maybe something like base defense encounters (start simple), one group/faction/guild attacking and one defending. Match queue and all that. Maybe a web based ladder. Possibly more encounter variations later, more complex, start with basics :)

I’ve been considering writing up a development document for it for some time, somewhat comprehensive, but I know the majority of interest is focused on just getting everything currently working. I figure by the time we switch modes to content expansion, this would be a good time to have something being figured out for pvp. Yeah, far unlike live.

(my self quote was from another thread, moved here now ) Edited by StarbuckJD

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You know I have been pushing for PvP There is something about trying to out-smart and battle a Living person, granted the DEVs have been trying to make the NPC AI a little more challenging and there has been some complaints about their efforts. IE: kiting, and running etc etc..

You can not predict what a Living breathing person is going to do and even if you could "HE WILL LEARN" and next time maybe, just maybe that person / Group will do something unexpected that you and yours did not anticipate and your Now on the run.

As things are now Every NPC that we have fought are predictable you know what they and their MOB are going to do. I AM confident that the DEVs and Betas (What few we have) will make the NPC AI more of a challenge, (Cloaked and Skill activations success etc etc)

IMO, an arena will not cut it and OPEN PvP would destroy the Game as we know it, and that is unacceptable !

The only way IMO is to have an entire sector for PvP, enter the sector your Labled PvP, up untill you leave the sector.
What is the motivation for this? How about 1000 explore XP per Nav point reguardless of your overall level (Times 130 NAVs to be discovered !) and Someone mentioned Tokens in another post, 1 token per player kill, (200 tokens = 1 skill point) per turn in to an NPC yet to be determined.

The other things we have to concider is that 1) the game will have a new level of excitement and 2) We will now be bringing in new Blood to the game some people that were hoping for some kind of PvP. WHILE MAINTAINING the feel and fun of our Earth and Beyond for EVERYONE !

Here's the Thing it looks like some of us are missing who says that there would only Be Jenquai or only Terran or Only Progen groups. Don't get me wrong when I say that I am not underestimating My Jenquai, IF you did it will be your Undoing :angry: . Nor do I think the Progen or the Terrans will be push overs, it is doable to do and to Die.

Sounds Dam exciting to Me !!

Phorlaug...

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Yeah, making pvp sectors I mentioned back in 2010 is one way to do it, and the easiest. Matches are maybe the best in some respects, but then it would take more to develop the system, mainly if it’s done right using instancing.

The idea of sectors was that the factions have bases on a timer, can only be conquered at set time intervals. Can be one main base per player faction or even a number of them at strategic locations. Some automated base defenses, but pretty much minimal.

As far as mobs in the sectors, maybe they drop PvP gear, parts and recipes. So pvp can reside in these sectors 24/7, including mining for special resources for pvp gear construction. But the real call to arms for fleet maneuvers comes with base timers allowing for bases to be conquered or even destroyed (at least deactivated). Bases could give some sort of benefit if remaining active after the battle, since inactive bases are more inclined to put all resources to repair and reactivation in preparation for the next interval.

Beyiond the basics:
Then I’d maybe add gate flags, only letting in pvp flagged characters which cant pvp outside of the sectors. This is just so non-pvp characters cannot interfere as sometimes happens outside of design. No worry though, I mean if pvm weapons cannot do any damage to players, then they would need pvp gear to defend themselves anyway, apart from spying and running away really fast heh

Another maybe in my mind is just making new classes, even starting at 150, whatever, right into the pvp sectors, new skills, weapons, all balanced out of the box. Forget the level grind, just work on kill scores, hunt after rare components etc. Worthless out of the PvP sectors though, not for regular pvm at all imo. Edited by StarbuckJD

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This is a whole can of worms. The end result is the few people with the biggest groups, best skills, best ships and best kit simply ganks everyone else. I'd rather effort was spent getting the core game fully functional without PvP. If you want PvP go play Eve!
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[quote name='Amethyst' timestamp='1327955278' post='52732']
This is a whole can of worms. The end result is the few people with the biggest groups, best skills, best ships and best kit simply ganks everyone else. I'd rather effort was spent getting the core game fully functional without PvP. If you want PvP go play Eve!
[/quote]Who is talking about doing this before the core game is fully functional? Lets be rational on this topic please, it's a discussion, and a Moderator opened this thread for us to discuss the issue if we wish to. I do play EVE (as most do who play EnB), what do you want to know about that game? Maybe you can start another topic on EVE for your questions. But this is a preliminary discussion, not a "I want" or "I don't want" debate/poll. One day EnB will have pvp, inevitably, since this still remains a community project, and will return to opensource at some point in all likelihood, which would make it even more likely for pvp development if not done sooner rather than later. So lets be mature, and stop telling members of the community to go away, that’s just rude.

As far as effort spent, if they did pick up a pvp project, I'm sure additional volunteers could be easily persuaded to produce the work so that the current endeavor isn't any lessened. A lot of people here with content dev skills, that probably wouldn’t volunteer otherwise. Edited by StarbuckJD

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I just wanna get me 3 PWS for DPS/Crowd Control with gravlink, 2 TTs for Healing/Repair, and a JE for a reactor battery/rezzer... and just go 6v6 against anyone who wants to pewpew.

Just sayin

or a 6xJD gank squad, AWWWWWW YEAAAAA! Edited by Dakynos

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[quote name='Ryle' timestamp='1327958166' post='52735']
or a 6xJD gank squad, AWWWWWW YEAAAAA!
[/quote]lol yeah, well that is end result however you cut it. I'm all for small group battles, more or less with around 20 players fighting it out in a gravity well. Even to whatever can be easiest implemented, it's at least a start. Edited by StarbuckJD

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[quote name='StarbuckJD' timestamp='1327958780' post='52739']
lol yeah, well that is end result however you cut it. I'm all for small group battles, more or less with around 20 players. Even to whatever can be easiest implemented, it's at least a start.
[/quote]

lol it would be like rolling a guild war/restuss pvp in SWG with all spies. Wait... wait.... surround... all 6 open up on 1 guy and just drop him. Cloak... rinse repeat, LOLOL Edited by Ryle

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What, pre-CU? I never stuck around for pvp post-NGE. I was into base busting and defense, an MBH General with piles of base deeds, hardly even hunted Jedee. Ummm... EVE used to have good plex battles, but then they turned it into some sort of pvm bomber runs for factions. Probably best example would be Allegiance if you ever looked into that one. Played PlanetSide for years, more base busting etc. WWII Online, even more base busting. It’s usually what draws more civil pvp
:D:D Edited by StarbuckJD

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[quote name='StarbuckJD' timestamp='1327960135' post='52746']
What, pre-CU? I never stuck around for pvp post-NGE. I was into base busting and defense, an MBH General with piles of base deeds, hardly even hunted Jedee. Ummm... EVE used to have good plex battles, but then they turned it into some sort of pvm bomber runs for factions. Probably best example would be Allegiance if you ever looked into that one. Played PlanetSide for years, more base busting etc. WWII Online, even more base busting. It’s usually what draws more civil pvp
:D:D:D
[/quote]
Nah spies were OP as hell in the latter years of the NGE (like 2009 and on). I played all 8 years. Never unlocked before the village, was away from the computer and gaming in general for like 2 years, came back to the NGE and basically did nothing but PvP from about 2008 on. I played all professions but was at my best as a medic(combat medic/doctor basically) officer(pistoleer/squad leader/buffmachine/actionbarbattery) or jedi (nerfed insanely post NGE, but still OP 1v1 by games end).
You missed the team battlefields. Those were epic and good quality IF people would actually try to build good teams and had a clue.
I havent had pvp since the game closed in december -.-

Miss mah battlefelds. Though you mentioned base busting. By the end of the game people were exploiting those by having opposite faction alts drop em, announce their blowup times, and then having like 200 friends come and have a campout while they freely blew the base XD

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We build wagon train cities, put our bases in the middle, watched them day and night, or as much as we could. In this case for EnB, I was thinking more of an opportunity timer, bases become attackable every 8 or 12 hours. Sort of like EVE faction timers, but those were once a day and usually around noon London time hah which was crud time for us Yanks. Timers because we have less people in this game, so bigger battles if not just a persistent base attack grind, which would dwindle in participation. But there would always be other things to fight over for small groups, like defending miners, so they can make pvp ammo, or even base repair etc. Edited by StarbuckJD

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[quote name='StarbuckJD' timestamp='1327956786' post='52733']
Who is talking about doing this before the core game is fully functional? Lets be rational on this topic please, it's a discussion, and a Moderator opened this thread for us to discuss the issue if we wish to. I do play EVE (as most do who play EnB), what do you want to know about that game? Maybe you can start another topic on EVE for your questions. But this is a preliminary discussion, not a "I want" or "I don't want" debate/poll. One day EnB will have pvp, inevitably, since this still remains a community project, and will return to opensource at some point in all likelihood, which would make it even more likely for pvp development if not done sooner rather than later. So lets be mature, and stop telling members of the community to go away, that’s just rude.

As far as effort spent, if they did pick up a pvp project, I'm sure additional volunteers could be easily persuaded to produce the work so that the current endeavor isn't any lessened. A lot of people here with content dev skills, that probably wouldn’t volunteer otherwise.
[/quote]

Soo what you are saying is that only pro PvP comments are welcome in this thread? I have it now. So when PvP comes into the game it will be, "you had your chance to object and you didn't say anything"
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[quote name='Mimir' timestamp='1327965549' post='52759']
ote]

Soo what you are saying is that only pro PvP comments are welcome in this thread? I have it now. So when PvP comes into the game it will be, "you had your chance to object and you didn't say anything"
[/quote]
There is a difference between discussing options for pvp and just posting "go play EVE", isn't there? Thought this thread was about discussing pvp "how to make it fun", not debating whether or not we are welcomed to play this game. After all the Mod entitled it “Pvp Discussion - how to make it fun” and that was what I thought the topic was about. Maybe start another thread “Pvp? - go play EVE!” or something? See, title is different. "PvP - good for EnB?" see, different title. "how to make it fun". I didn't write it, but that is sort of how it appears. Edited by StarbuckJD
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i've got to say i'm against the pvp concept! the game was never intended to be pvp and as such any implementation of it will only add more "nerf this class, nerf that one" posts in the forum! this will have a detrimental effect on the overall enjoyment of the game! if u wish to have pvp in a space game there are many out there to choose from! why try to change this one to satisfy the ego-mongers out there that want to shout "Pwned" all day?
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[quote name='Amethyst' timestamp='1327955278' post='52732']
This is a whole can of worms. The end result is the few people with the biggest groups, best skills, best ships and best kit simply ganks everyone else. I'd rather effort was spent getting the core game fully functional without PvP. If you want PvP go play Eve!
[/quote]

We are talking about an entirely new sector, Don't want to PvP don't enter.
We're talking about making something for everyone. I'm not dising your opinion I fully understand your concern.
But, we are talking about making it [u]Purely elective PvP, [/u]some people are completly content with what we have now, thats great ! Seriously everyone donates and life is great

StarbuckJD how about this for a Reward.
New items for the New Classes, NPC drops or Token rewards, Non-tradeable Non-manufacture eh eh ?
Now we're talking.
But I seriously would like to see New Class items way sooner than this PvP would ever come to fruition.

If we keep our senses and keep talking about this in a calm civilized manner we all will come up with something great.
I said this years ago, we have the opportunity to make and mold a game here that most Players could only dream of doing.
Keep Donating and be patient and Dream.

Phorlaug...

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[quote name='Brixun' timestamp='1327967692' post='52762']
ego-mongers
[/quote]If you actually read the topic, some of us our batting around the idea of other/new zones. Unless you are in those other pvp zones, you won't even know pvp exists, and there won't be any reason for you to be there unless you pvp. Lets keep the name calling down to a minimum, please.

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