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Lannister

Why I Think We Need A Player Wipe.

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[quote name='Orga2' timestamp='1327776606' post='52597']but If we all focused on the progress instead of the "known" bugs and errors in-game.
[/quote]You just may be a beta tester candidate for CCP Games :D All the chips and soda you can consume, *yum* Friday pizza parties too! While they play WoW all the day long, with breaks to play the SIMS now and then. lol

But seriously, content progress over known bug squishing? Sounds nice, but in practice... oh my. Bugs beget bugs, cascades of little pattering feet running up and down warm memory chips. Long legs blurred by sheer speed (or shader effects) and alien like eyes peering through the artifact laden pixels. Ok more seriously, should be able to do both, just not as fast. Bugs suck. It's often why I remind them that opening server source back up may be beneficial for getting past content development stopping bugs. Bugs just need to be dealt with, it's a common position of many players in most game communities. Edited by StarbuckJD

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First off - Wow. I had no idea it would morf into such a thread. Good discusions though.

And I get it - most of you are not in favor of a wipe at this time, I get that too.

So Kyp, Cdel, or whoever:

Can I volunteer for my main toon, Lannister, leveled back to 0? Given we are not doing a general wipe I would just as soon keep my prints, items, and money. But I would be happy to do some testing of missions by going through the process again. I think it would be fun. I am maxed out now with nothing to do but collect points so lets start the fun all over.

If we get commands to do this ourselves (one way only in play I would suggest) then great. If we need to put in a request, then that works too.

If more people do it then more of the lower lvl content gets worked out anyway.

Lann

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[quote name='Lannister' timestamp='1327781416' post='52602']
If more people do it then more of the lower lvl content gets worked out anyway.
[/quote]I log my JE now and then, lots of people running out of net-7 mission terms. Still pretty populated in newbie-secs. Terrans camping drones at Earth. Not sure about Progens, probably collecting issues of playboy lol. Low level missions have probably been tested more than anything. It's more content related, which probably needs new content to test, when it does. It's more about balancing and skills it has been mentioned I think. Also doing things that can bring down the server as always, I mean normal things to report, like moving items around in the vault or what have you, or to CTD's. I think this is why they are not so worried about a wipe just now, nor running lowbie missions.

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I see this whole project as a huge privilege - to be able to play E&B again - and props to all the developers for the thousands of hours that have gone into this. We all know how heart-wrenching it is to lose our chars, but we all have the experience and knowledge to level up pretty quickly. In fact I think a new start will be good for the game with people working together to do their stuff.

Having been in ST2 and ST3 I'm just amazed ST4 is still going and I can enjoy pushing into the high-end stuff a little more. For me the endgame not about being able to spank L60 stuff for a little longer, its about wandering around the maelstroms, Ardus and Der Todesengel again, seeing Vrix again, get the disabled missions working again, new missions and kit, and perhaps see yet-to-be discovered systems, and even new raids (loved the Halloween raid - pretty please can we have the figurine drop again - even if rarely). We have seen great progress, and I'm sure there is more to come. If a wipe helps, a wipe helps.

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Remember guys, this is not an immediate by a long shot, we don't think we need it at this time, but eventually we will need to focus test various systems, and we get the best results by hammering it out. If any of you have been in a "closed beta" you'll be familiar with a repeated wipe and being told to check out system X.

Like I said before, we can restore data for now, but one day it will go the way of the dodo (probably around the release)

Lann, if you want I'm sure we can figure something out.

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In all honesty I do not like the idea of a player wipe. Yet I fully understand the need for this. It will be great when we are live and playing with a fresh data base. So despite the ominous clouds on the horizon I will continue to play.
It is however a very valid consideration as this game has been in development far longer than most and in all reality there is really only so much that can be expected of beta testers before some break.

Most of us already understand that player wipes were part of this testing period and yes some will quit. That is unfortunate. But as I said, we knew this would happen and we can continue to haggle over the inevitable or simply accept the wipe and continue on.

We don't have to like it!

Maybe we can expedite it and get it over with and behind us! LOL!

Lastly though, I do think it a good idea to reach some point of being able to state 'Last Player Wipe" or something to that effect because; as much as we understand the need for a wipe, they do have very negative effects on folks including negative PR, word of mouth, to potential new players. So having a final announcement would inspire and encourage old and new player support.

That being said, all these posts contain honest and great opinions and suggestions on the subject and I would like to make a few comments.

[b]Declining player numbers.[/b]
IMHO, I believe that we in fact do lose players who don't want to invest the time building an avatar only to have it wiped.
Many of these players are waiting for enb to go live, then they will come back. Others may well be gone forever.
When we do go live, many more players will be attracted to the game and our player numbers will increase probably much quicker than is expected or anticipated. People will come, people will go and new people, of all ages, will continue to discover this game as long as it remains!

[b]Beta tester avatar rewards[/b]
One thing to remember is that we already have many benefits of having tested this game and when we go live, we can utilize this knowledge. This includes:[list]
[*]insta guilds
[*]well established contacts within and without our guilds
[*]mob and loot locations
[*]weapons, devices, buffs usage, etc.
[*]familiarity with missions and such of this emulator
[*]other game play knowledge
[/list]
So at the very least we won't be entering the game completely new or blind.

My advice to all and I am certain you're already on this, is to come up with a recovery plan for your player or guild. Working together, knowing these benefits, will enable all of us to re-gain the levels we enjoy much more quickly.

Finally, I would not be against some sort of avatar conciliatory gesture such as a one time character per player being bestowed with 400 SP's (Snicker)

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This is my opinion though I'm sure I'm not the only one that feels this way. I havent played this emu for nearly 2 years because I'm sick of starting the SAME character over and over again. Personally, I pretty much hate sub level 120 or so leveling, the game doesn't really get fun for me till level 8-9 weapons and equipment. before that there is just not much exciment because everyone has the exact same loadout with the exact same equipment because it is so easy for someone to build you the best of everything early on. at least with level 8 and 9 there are a TON of options and no one build is 100% better in every situation than another.

Wipe the equipment, credits, and all extra skill points, all mission data, all nav locations. Hell, you can even wipe my EL down to 0 and CL down to 36 or 42, but please please don't make me start back at level 000 again and please leave my TL the hell alone. The grind in this game is too damn boring and the only thing that gets me through it is knowing i'll get to have fun when its over, but not if you guys keep resetting me back to square one! Even if this game does eventually go live I'll probably be to bored of the grind for the 5 or 6th damn time to ever come back and play it!
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Not playing for the last 2 yrs was a big mistake on your part. There hasn't been a wipe during that time and there has been much improvement during this period. If you took the time to read the entire thread you would already know all this.

Your suggestion sounds like you want an entire new game in place of what we have here. Consider how much work there would be for the Devs if they throw away and replace everything they have done.

Do not underestimate the hard work done by those builders that do build high quality equipment. You want to keep your trade level, so you must understand building is linked to it.

We all agree the grind is boring and that more mid-level content would be a great addition. We can all hope the Devs will address that once they are happy with overall game performance.

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:o I come back after a months rest to this crap again.... :mad: Give it a rest and wait for Beta, then you will get your wipe. And I bet the same ppl will be bitching about that too.

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This topic is a dead horse that rears its ugly head about once a month it seems. And in all honesty completely kills my urge to keep playing. Perhaps there is middle ground somewhere in that the wipe could possibly be vaulentary. Knowing that would likely help stave off a lot of bad feelings that keeps this topic resurrecting itself periodically.

Something that has never been brought up is the possibility to write a data converter to take the old player data from the old DB and place it correctly into the new DB. This shouldn't be too difficult to write.

Thanks for reading...

-Overt.
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When EnB was live, I was in college and had plenty of time to play. Nowdays time is very limited. To have my character deleted after putting in countless hours is no longer an option for me. I do want to play, but I do not want to lose all my time and effort again.
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For all the P-wipe worriers:
Play for the fun of it.....so your toon gets knocked to 0...so what? Play some more and enjoy. Life is not about the destination, but rather the journey.

Are you getting to such and such a level so you can hang it on the mantle? Or rather playing because you enjoy it? If you're a trophy player then by all means, invest your time elsewere ( Ihear DC universe is F2P now and DDO,Lotro etc. :)), but if you're the type that loves this game...PLAY ON! And see you in game!

Matt
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Matt I dont see why youre so dismissive of things like that. You do realize EnB is one of the hardest/longest level grinds out of all MMOs right? Having to start back from zero after literal months of leveling... really sucks.
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Everyone that wants a player wipe :mad: :angry:









please delete your worthless toons and start over and leave me alone~!~! :) :P ;)
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Lol..yeh it is hard......and time consuming......and FREE IN A ALPHA STATE.
Dismissive? I am ALWAYS dismissive of Epeens, its a GAME...intended for FUN, if you are playing just so you can say," oh look what i have done, and this is what I looted" I'm dismissive of that indeed. That is not unlike a hunter that kills a wonderful animal, discards all the skin, the meat, complains about the weather and then takes the horns to mount on the wall, just so they can brag to their friends over cocktails.

Did you not have fun getting to whatever lvl you are? If not, then why are you playing?
Like my previous post...it's the JOURNEY not the destination.

"Kids, I know you hate to pick up your toys, (that you had a fun time playing with for hours) but if you help me now pick them up( testing), and then go wash up for dinner(p-wipe), we are going to have your favorite meal, and if you can do it without complaining..why there just might be some ICE CREAM for dessert! What do you think of that! YAY!"(sunrise final state)
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Matt it gets old. I have one 150 toon. Its all I want. The rest are for the "fun of leveling"
I like high end content, I want to be able to play it. TBH there isnt much leveling content beyond agrippa and home sector stuff out there besides the repetitive HU30s everyone hates.

Its just the same thing, groundhog day, over and over. Jobs, traderuns, shooting the same mobs a billion times. Maybe if it didnt take 5 hours to level from say CL 45 to CL 46, it wouldnt be so bad. But once someone gets to level 100 or so, leveling is just the kinda PITA i dont want to invest all my time for. Its a grind, a ridiculous horrible grind, and frankly being resubjected to it for NO REASON other than someone being bored of their 150s, pisses me off.

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I mean back in live leveling wasnt such a chore. You could group up with people and farm VG or cooper and actually have fun.

Now that everyone just multiboxes all day, its rare to get into groups with different players for leveling. Yes I want to play an MMO to spend my whole playtime alone. I cant even DO anything with anyone else until im 150, and you know it!

Wiping the base wouldnt even encourage low end anyway. Most people would multibox themselves back to 150, raid only again, and the rest of the playerbase would be left doing what I do, wandering around aimlessly with no one answering grouping calls, everyone at different levels, playing a 1 player game.


I understand the need for actual maintenance wipes and so on, those are already understood, but an arbitrary and unneeded wipe because someone is sick of being maxed?

Hell, can I have your stuff? Give it to me and delete your toons if nothing else. Edited by Ryle

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[quote name='Ryle' timestamp='1331276337' post='55200']
I mean back in live leveling wasnt such a chore. You could group up with people and farm VG or cooper and actually have fun.


Hell, can I have your stuff? Give it to me and delete your toons if nothing else.
[/quote]


I get half !!!

Join us again next week for another episode of: As the Solar System Turns :o
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[quote name='Ryle' timestamp='1331276337' post='55200']
I mean back in live leveling wasnt such a chore. [/quote]

Back in live combat exp was based on your level vs mob level, regardless of what level the rest of the group was (as long as everyone was within exp range of the mob killed). This made getting CLs extremely easy if you could get into highlevel groups (and stay alive :P) and it made composition of groups less relevant.
Although that system might not be the best solution, it definately made combat groups more common than what we have now.

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[quote name='Totte' timestamp='1331302830' post='55215']
Back in live combat exp was based on your level vs mob level, regardless of what level the rest of the group was (as long as everyone was within exp range of the mob killed). This made getting CLs extremely easy if you could get into highlevel groups (and stay alive :P) and it made composition of groups less relevant.
Although that system might not be the best solution, it definately made combat groups more common than what we have now.
[/quote]
Oh that was early on live, they did away with that within a few months, when you saw peeps offering power leveling services for X amount of credits, or PL guilds (ones who did nothing but group others for PLing as their mission statement "to get to end content as fast as possible"), it not only pissed the base off (as some used the services AND complained about others using the service :)), but conserned the Dev enough about content burn that they had at least 2 experience retooling in a short order of time.

The exp range was always being retooled, since you had those that would sit near a gate gun, well protected, and contribute zip to a combat group and totally leech combat range was real short, but becuase of miners needing to spread out and thier guardian maybe chase mobs out of range during defense, they had to move Exp grouping a bit farther out, it was in early on like 100km, I think after final retooling it was 20km.

I think the final Cxp retool had it based on the highest lvl player in the group, they got the xp they got based on mob killed and number of players in group devisable, then group bonus added back, this prevented that CL10 toon from getting 8k xp from a CL50 doing all the work, the final retool also had the lower lvl have to get mobs agro check involved..i.e. they had to at least nick the mob once, or toss a heal, or administer a buff during combat to share.

But I now they did away with you vs. mob xp gain regardless of rest of group thing real early on.

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I screwed up amd max explore and trade on my JD 147 JS 148 and JE 146 which makes maxing combat damn near impossible.
so I started a copule of terrans and I am having fun with the missles skills.... Max them and i go to Porgen....

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[quote name='AZdexter' timestamp='1331334426' post='55239']
I screwed up amd max explore and trade on my JD 147 JS 148 and JE 146 which makes maxing combat damn near impossible.
so I started a copule of terrans and I am having fun with the missles skills.... Max them and i go to Porgen....
[/quote]

Curious, how is max EL and TL on a Jenquai toon before max CL screwing up? Usually that's the best way to level a Jenquai toon especially a JE. Or are you kidding?

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seems if I do combat jobs half goes to explore/trade so I don't get the total experance. At least that is what I was seeing awhile ago. I will log my guys and try it again incase that has changed. (or was i seeing things?)

will check it out tonight...thanks for the resopse. (is there spell check on the fourms?)

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yup Most of AZwoodmanJD skill points for a lvl 135 combat job from F7 went to explore and trade which are all ready maxed out. So it was so painfull to try to level to max combat I just strated Terran toons....please dont tell me this is a bug~!~!

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The trade and explore xp is rolled over to your non 50 skill. There is some loss (think its around 20% now which just disappears) but the rest will go directly to your CL. If its not doing this bug it.

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