Portal Discussions inc DBv2 (Merged)

[Yuritau]

Saw the notice over on enbdatabase.net-7.org just now, and wanted to put up a protest against the disabling of that site.

It's nice to hear that the new site will be all kinds of up-to-date and stuff, but imho, it's also less user-friendly. I'll use the new database if I want to get accurate information about drop locations or for looking up builders, but for pretty much everything else the old site is far easier to use. I like being able to right click stuff and "open in new tab" to do comparisons and whatnot, and the new site does not allow it, so please don't take it away from me.

[Lot]

Yes, I really appreciated the old interface too because of its user friendliness and speed. Being able to quickly open items in new tabs on a multi-tabbed browser was made of win. Each time I see the loading icon spinning on the new interface I want to stab the screen. I wish the old interface could remain somehow even if some features were stripped out to remove deprecated functionality like everything enabled by logging in to the old interface and the builder listing.

[Slayerman]

OK,

Ive stripped it down so it only shows item stats for comparisons, i may consider leaving this live if the game the Game Devs have no objections.

Thanks

[Lot]

Perfect, thanks.

[Ranko[IS]]

I too like the older edition of the database, mainly because it is faster, I can use it on my iphone with ease, and various other aspects, such as maulti-tabs.

Could the database from the newer one, be linked or used to update the one you wish to remove? Thus allowing us older-timers who like the older version access to the newer information?

[fuulishone]

Will the old, stripped down interface at least have access to updated item specific info? Specifically things like build costs, recipes, perhaps item reload/damage/buff changes?

I know that philosophically neither database will show the actual percentages/values associated with buffs, so that's fine. I just want to know that I can use either interchangeably for their intended purposes without having to worry about synchronization.

If the answer is that the old interface will continue to point to data that's out of date (and again, I'm only referring to the slimmed down filtered information, not drops or locations), then leaving it up provides a lot less value, despite being a much friendlier interface for the purposes already discussed above.

[Doctor Tiki]

I too like the older edition of the database, mainly because it is faster, I can use it on my iphone with ease, and various other aspects, such as maulti-tabs.

Could the database from the newer one, be linked or used to update the one you wish to remove? Thus allowing us older-timers who like the older version access to the newer information?

Agreed. It seems like a no brainer if you compare the sites on ease of use and performance. I have never been impressed with the layout/navigation on the main net-7.org site, and now we are forced to use it for everything? The old site was lightyears ahead of this one. Please just transplant the data.

[Terrell [BT]]

Count me as an "I like the old version better" vote. I found the older version more user friendly for the same reasons stated earlier in this thread.

[garblesoup]

Count me as an "I like the old version better" vote. I found the older version more user friendly for the same reasons stated earlier in this thread.

I also agree.

As a counterpoint, though, is it possible to address some of the issues that currently make the new site less user-friendly than the old site? Understand I in no way mean to sound ungrateful about the effort put in to develop it, it's just that by comparison to the old interface it's "clunky".

[Muhir]

I dunno, Slayer, I kinda like the new interface. The only thing I may suggest is add what mob drops the item. Let us figure out where the mob may be, but at least tell us the source.

But, over all, I like it and appreciate the effort you took to make it.

[Yuritau]

I'll use the new database if I want to get accurate information about drop locations or for looking up builders..

Okay, I guess I was wrong, since the new database only shows you the mob, without telling you where to find it. Why the obfuscation? At this point in the life of EnB, why is it necessary to REDUCE the information available to players?

I'll second Doctor Tiki's request to simply update the data of the old site. It's a better site in literally every way (well, before the pruning, anyways).

[r8rsfans75]

I dunno, Slayer, I kinda like the new interface. The only thing I may suggest is add what mob drops the item. Let us figure out where the mob may be, but at least tell us the source.

But, over all, I like it and appreciate the effort you took to make it.

Unless I am missing something, there is a drop section down at the bottom, you click "show" and it lists the mobs that drop it.

[Muhir]

Unless I am missing something, there is a drop section down at the bottom, you click "show" and it lists the mobs that drop it.

Only thing i see there on the item page itself is a builder list not a mob drop.

Edit:

I guess I should have looked up an item that was currently dropping in game.

You are correct mob is shown. So, Slayer, ignore me.

Edited December 6, 2010 by Muhir

[Yuritau]

You are correct mob is shown. So, Slayer, ignore me.

Mob is shown. But the sectors that mob can be found in are no longer shown.

[DarkkHero]

Slayerman, first off, thank you for all the hard work you have put in on the website, and Net-7. I can speak for everyone when I say, Great Job!

On this particular matter though, I will have to side with the community. The database interface for Net-7 is...complicated.

It's a bit hard to read. The transparency overlay is the major thing I have a problem with. Is there a way to disable that at least?

Also, the black and blue, while my favorite colors, are a harsh contrast. Would it be possible to knock it down to a 333333 and 6699CC scheme, maybe?

Regardless, thanks again for the hard work.

[Slayerman]

I have removed the transparency from the database to make it a little easier to read.

[Slayerman]

Okay, I guess I was wrong, since the new database only shows you the mob, without telling you where to find it. Why the obfuscation? At this point in the life of EnB, why is it necessary to REDUCE the information available to players?

To make it so we can add new content without giving things away

I'll second Doctor Tiki's request to simply update the data of the old site. It's a better site in literally every way (well, before the pruning, anyways).

Because i made that site before i was put on the team, as is totally seperate from the one the Emu team asked me to do.

As i am working heavily on the new portal, i dont have time to really start messing with 2 seperate sites.

In 'live' - the info available was only done by the community itself, someone wrote it and maintained it with updates to items, drops, stats.

I personally dont have time to do this, and since we no longer get dumps of the database frequently this means only manual updates are possible.

There is nothing stopping anyone else creating a public database and keeping it up to date, this it was how it was done in the past.

The team asked me to join up and bring my database to the community as part of the project which i accepted.

I understand the other database was easier to use in terms of multiple pages etc, and i am trying to work on something similar to my old site, so watch this space.

'EnB Database' will remain as it is now

As for it being faster, it is hosted on the same spec server with the same code (yes, it just looks a little different). It uses background processing so you dont actually see the work until its on your screen which may appear to run a little slow, and will soon be connecting to the LIVE database so the data will be up the minute.

The benefits on the Net-7 portal version are there if you look beyond appearance.

I hope this explains a few things, if not, feel free to ask away.

[fuulishone]

@Slayerman

Perhaps an alternative then? If the portal's access to the database already takes care of filtering out hidden stuff (i.e., to prevent spoilers) would you perhaps be open to allowing folks to retrieve data through the portal in the raw? Like perhaps through an XML interface or something so that folks can use this data feed to create their own interface? The source data would still come through the portal and thus be subject to whatever rules are used to cleanse the data. It's simply a means for folks to create their own UI for the data.

[Slayerman]

@Slayerman

Perhaps an alternative then? If the portal's access to the database already takes care of filtering out hidden stuff (i.e., to prevent spoilers) would you perhaps be open to allowing folks to retrieve data through the portal in the raw? Like perhaps through an XML interface or something so that folks can use this data feed to create their own interface? The source data would still come through the portal and thus be subject to whatever rules are used to cleanse the data. It's simply a means for folks to create their own UI for the data.

Bit like the Eve API.

Its possible, but without any time to develop this it wont happen any time soon.

Also, i very much doubt the devs would allow a connection to the live to pull a live feed of any type, including XML.

This would put a lot more load on live server as more and more sites pop up using the XML Feed, if a Dev would like to answer this, then i would be grateful of an offical response.

The other option would be providing dumps with content removed, maybe this can happen once development is coming to and end, and the devs have time to work on the dump.

What ever way the data is extracted, it needs to be in a format people can use without the hidden content.

I am going to work on providing the multiple windows people are asking for.

[fuulishone]

Yes, very similar to the EVE API, but without all the account level stuff they have. What I'm asking for is meant to be read-only and similar to how RSS feeds work on news sites.

If the ability to request and download a full (filtered) XML feed is only accessible through the portal, then you could easily impose restrictions such as a ) folks must be logged in, and b ) you may make the request once per day. Also, if the XML file itself was set to be cacheable at the browser, then normal browser rules could kick in and not even re-request the file. Would that satisfy the load balancing as well as access concerns?

[Terrell [BT]]

Will it be possible, at some point in the future to search by buff, rather than only by item name?

[fuulishone]

Will it be possible, at some point in the future to search by buff, rather than only by item name?

On the portal, you can do that now. Click the text "Effects" above the search window and it'll change to the old effects search that's available on the old database site.

Note: For some reason it doesn't look like a link in my browser, but clicking it does work.

[Terrell [BT]]

On the portal, you can do that now. Click the text "Effects" above the search window and it'll change to the old effects search that's available on the old database site.

Note: For some reason it doesn't look like a link in my browser, but clicking it does work.

Thanks, I must have overlooked that, will try shortly.

[Slayerman]

Check out Portal DB V2.0

http://www.net-7.org

[Slayerman]

Read the announcement here.

Then discuss away