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Pit Mechanic's Toolbox.. TT only?


sunvillage

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There is a nice device in game, that helps with the build chances for engines.

Of course I am talking about the Pit Mechanic's Toolbox, L8 device, which is now available through hulks.

But, alas, it is for Terran Tradesman only.

There are actually three other classes in game that build engines, the Terran Enforcer, the Terran Scout and the Jenquai Seeker.

Is there any chance - or is it even wanted - to remove the restriction from this device?

Edith:

thx Terrell for filling my memory gap :)

Edited by Shuzun
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There is a nice device in game, that helps with the build chances for engines.

Of course I am talking about the Pit Mechanic's Toolbox, L8 device, which is now available through hulks.

But, alas, it is for Terran Tradesman only.

There are two other classes in game that build engines, the Terran Enforcer and the Jenquai Seeker.

Is there any chance - or is it even wanted - to remove the restriction from this device?

The Terran Scout also builds engines in addition to the Seeker, Tradesman, and Enforcer.

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I don't think devices that help with build chances work right now, so it might be a moot point for the moment. I would say the device should be Terran only, since they're the engine specialists. I'm not really sure why it would be TT only; that seems a bit too specific. If nothing else, the Scout should be allowed to use it.

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It started out TT only but the restrictions were removed.

Content Tweaks (Patch Message for 2/13/2004)

Hello all,

We're pushing a small content patch this evening to address a few odds and ends that didn't quite make our game update last week. Here are the details:

Improved the Tech 8 and 9 versions of the "Repair the Shear" mission reward weapons. They should now be more desirable.

Anselm Ville no longer gets confused and refuses to talk to some people. Now he'll happily sell to anyone.

Councillor Rafa ben Erela won't sell the Schematic for the Sharushar Invisible Eye to Progen anymore.

Players will no longer be able to buy any item that they cannot use from the Mars Construction Project. Please make sure you thoroughly review the item you're requesting before you trade in your process passes.

The Barbed Fishing Hook can now be made by Terran Tradesmen.

Increased the number of Brood Oil that drop.

Removed profession restrictions from the Pit Mechanic's Toolbox.

Fixed an issue with the der Todesengel sector gate in Witberg. It will now be visible on player nav maps once visited. InfinitiCorp denies any responsibility for the abnormal behavior of navigation maps near the der Todesengel gate.

- Cerdith

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I don't think devices that help with build chances work right now, so it might be a moot point for the moment.

Well, when I use a shield or reactor build computer, the chances - according to the machine - do rise by a few %.

I would say the device should be Terran only, since they're the engine specialists. I'm not really sure why it would be TT only; that seems a bit too specific. If nothing else, the Scout should be allowed to use it.

(and the TE) :)

Sounds like a good compromise (I may be biased, because my engine builder is a TE).

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I would say the device should be Terran only, since they're the engine specialists. I'm not really sure why it would be TT only; that seems a bit too specific. If nothing else, the Scout should be allowed to use it.

Making it Terran only and thus restricting it from the Jenquai Seeker seems a bit unneccesary. From the Seeker's point of view build engines is bad enough without Terrans having an edge at it.

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(and the TE) :)

Sounds like a good compromise (I may be biased, because my engine builder is a TE).

Makes sense, to me too, since the TW seems to be more skill point friendly than the Scout (after Scout gets Afterburn & Null-Factor) when it comes to building engines. My TW builds both as well, while my Scout only does devices. My Scout trades her device building service to my TW for his weapon and ammo building service.

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when the TS can build reactors we can apply your logic... well i mean... there are 3 other classes in the game that build reactors... so why not let the TS build reactors too...

this solves a bunch of problems... cuz now we dont have to worry about the TS needing to use the PitMechBox for one... and one less class building useless engines... its actually very exciting... I say lets do it :)

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when the TS can build reactors we can apply your logic...

All I can say is "Don't hold your breath."

To give them reactors I'd have to nerf them in several other ways, no thanks. It may not be the most optimal build skill to have engines, but it is a racial specialty. Also, keep in mind that the higher grade engines will be a lot more useful by the time we get to "live" again. There won't be any more of this taking engine tech to IV Or V and it being good enough for end-game... at least not unless you want to gimp yourself before you ever get started.

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It started out TT only but the restrictions were removed.

Content Tweaks (Patch Message for 2/13/2004)

Hello all,

We're pushing a small content patch this evening to address a few odds and ends that didn't quite make our game update last week. Here are the details:

Improved the Tech 8 and 9 versions of the "Repair the Shear" mission reward weapons. They should now be more desirable.

Anselm Ville no longer gets confused and refuses to talk to some people. Now he'll happily sell to anyone.

Councillor Rafa ben Erela won't sell the Schematic for the Sharushar Invisible Eye to Progen anymore.

Players will no longer be able to buy any item that they cannot use from the Mars Construction Project. Please make sure you thoroughly review the item you're requesting before you trade in your process passes.

The Barbed Fishing Hook can now be made by Terran Tradesmen.

Increased the number of Brood Oil that drop.

Removed profession restrictions from the Pit Mechanic's Toolbox.

Fixed an issue with the der Todesengel sector gate in Witberg. It will now be visible on player nav maps once visited. InfinitiCorp denies any responsibility for the abnormal behavior of navigation maps near the der Todesengel gate.

- Cerdith

Hi

A correction has been implemented on this item. It should show up on the next content push.

Riia

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All I can say is "Don't hold your breath."

To give them reactors I'd have to nerf them in several other ways, no thanks. It may not be the most optimal build skill to have engines, but it is a racial specialty. Also, keep in mind that the higher grade engines will be a lot more useful by the time we get to "live" again. There won't be any more of this taking engine tech to IV Or V and it being good enough for end-game... at least not unless you want to gimp yourself before you ever get started.

That's nice to know. My TW is very happy to hear that, but so are all my other chars.

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Also, keep in mind that the higher grade engines will be a lot more useful by the time we get to "live" again. There won't be any more of this taking engine tech to IV Or V and it being good enough for end-game... at least not unless you want to gimp yourself before you ever get started.

I hope the fix won't be by nerfing the lower-level engines. :)

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Making it Terran only and thus restricting it from the Jenquai Seeker seems a bit unneccesary. From the Seeker's point of view build engines is bad enough without Terrans having an edge at it.

Engines, as Kyp pointed out, are the Terran specialty. Thusly, it wouldn't make sense to let the JS be as good at building engines as the Terrans are.

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Engines, as Kyp pointed out, are the Terran specialty. Thusly, it wouldn't make sense to let the JS be as good at building engines as the Terrans are.

True. Besides I doubt that the JT cares much on this one. For her it makes more sense, as a builder, to focus on Reactors since that's where she has the least competition. PT can't build Jen reactors, and JE doesn't have Negotiate 5. What she really wants to use is probably the Scientist's Data Cube, and Specialized Build Computer R9, but she only has L8 Device Tech.

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I hope the fix won't be by nerfing the lower-level engines. :)

Correct me if I'm wrong Kyp but I don't believe you are talking about nerfing lower level engines as much as are you talking about thrust and maneuvarability being more evident (or useful) for the higher level engines than what exists now? Or perhaps some buffs that aren't working now that will be working later?

As I have stated before I never got very far in live, so I have no frame of reference as to what the capabilities of engines were at levels higher than 4 or 5, and as of right now in the emulator, don't see any need to increase my skill level in that area any higher than 5 (which is where it is at right now).

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Correct me if I'm wrong Kyp but I don't believe you are talking about nerfing lower level engines as much as are you talking about thrust and maneuvarability being more evident (or useful) for the higher level engines than what exists now? Or perhaps some buffs that aren't working now that will be working later?

As I have stated before I never got very far in live, so I have no frame of reference as to what the capabilities of engines were at levels higher than 4 or 5, and as of right now in the emulator, don't see any need to increase my skill level in that area any higher than 5 (which is where it is at right now).

Basically, items are really Riia's domain, but we intend to do some stuff to make them more viable. As a frame of reference in live, the difference was high level engines were much better in terms of stats. You were faster in every way, the downside is you might as well have had your own personal nav beacon on the ship since you could draw enemies from miles around. Most people could get up to the warp cap with lower level engines, and thus they didn't care to spend more points on other skills but not everyone did that. I remember taking engine tech to IX on every toon.

In any case, we want to do something to make engines worthwhile, hopefully that doesn't mean doing any weakening but instead adding buffs. However, i can't speak for everyone. We'll look into it when it comes time, we'll do our best to avoid reducing effectiveness but I can't promise that everything will remain 100% the same. To say it now before we've even begun to run numbers would be a lie. :)

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Looking forward to seeing how they were improved. IMO the SS8 in Live was a reason to raise engine tech to L8 for everybody, however, it didn't enter the game until DT opened. The SS7 was also a good engine. I hope there is variety in what you can get in engines in terms stats & buffs with the improvements. My Jenquai toons and my Scout will automatically gravitate towards the lower sig engines as a matter of survival. I do think it will take one heck of an engine to get me to pick it over the Reinforced Solar Sail L8 on my toons, and especially my Jen toons. I can't think of a L8 engine I would choose over the SS8 given the choice.

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Engines, as Kyp pointed out, are the Terran specialty. Thusly, it wouldn't make sense to let the JS be as good at building engines as the Terrans are.

You can justify a LOT by using the storyline as an excuse.

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You can justify a LOT by using the storyline as an excuse.

Why oh why would we break from the storyline? There'd have to be a good case made for that, not just a desire for it. I don't allow Terrans to have build reactors because they suck at energy management, therefore even if they could make reactors, those reactors would be terrible. That is their defined weakness as originally designed. Progen can't make engines (I believe) and they are terribly slow but are capable of packing quite a punch... when they get there. I forget what it is Jenquai can't build right off hand but I'm sure it's related to their racial weakness as well.

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Why oh why would we break from the storyline? There'd have to be a good case made for that, not just a desire for it. I don't allow Terrans to have build reactors because they suck at energy management, therefore even if they could make reactors, those reactors would be terrible. That is their defined weakness as originally designed. Progen can't make engines (I believe) and they are terribly slow but are capable of packing quite a punch... when they get there. I forget what it is Jenquai can't build right off hand but I'm sure it's related to their racial weakness as well.

Jenquai cannot build shields since it's our racial weakness. JT builds everything except shields, JE devices & Reactors, JW weapons & devices. When our custom shields enter the game, we'll be looking for a TT that has them in his recipe book.

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Why oh why would we break from the storyline? There'd have to be a good case made for that, not just a desire for it.

This desire is only for an 'as balanced as possible' game. Playability over storyline with certain limits would be nice, like:

Your Terran build reactor example - ofcourse it should not be implemented. It would make a Terran the most desirable reactor builder...

However, things like Pit Mechanics toolbox being Terran only is just to piss off Jenquai traders.

I don't allow Terrans to have build reactors because they suck at energy management, therefore even if they could make reactors, those reactors would be terrible. That is their defined weakness as originally designed. Progen can't make engines (I believe) and they are terribly slow but are capable of packing quite a punch... when they get there. I forget what it is Jenquai can't build right off hand but I'm sure it's related to their racial weakness as well.

You said: ''I don't allow Terrans to have build reactors''. By this and your Lead Developer tag I take you are the Terran Lead Developer...

But you don't even know the Jenquai racial weakness?!

That is like not knowing Africans are black.

Now I Neeed to know what you are smoking as I'd sure like to try some :blink:

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This desire is only for an 'as balanced as possible' game. Playability over storyline with certain limits would be nice, like:

Your Terran build reactor example - ofcourse it should not be implemented. It would make a Terran the most desirable reactor builder...

However, things like Pit Mechanics toolbox being Terran only is just to piss off Jenquai traders.

You said: ''I don't allow Terrans to have build reactors''. By this and your Lead Developer tag I take you are the Terran Lead Developer...

But you don't even know the Jenquai racial weakness?!

That is like not knowing Africans are black.

Now I Neeed to know what you are smoking as I'd sure like to try some :blink:

Well, ya know. I care about Terrans. I don't really have many interactions with the Jenquai yet as most of the major content stuff that's done is in our home areas as we plan to expand from there.. I thought it was shields to be honest but wasn't for sure. It's not something i need to have in mind to design anything for story interactions between them since we've not begun on re-balancing anything really, as of yet. We're putting it back as a baseline, then we'll go through and run a lot of numbers and determine what's good to fix and what's not.

I am the Terran lead indeed. Now, with your imminent knowledge of the innards of the game, or rather your capabilities within creating it at the moment, tell me why you think I need to know about that or use it on a daily basis. I am interested in how you determine this to be a flaw in ability. :lol:

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I'm just worried you might make a mission where you have to talk to this Sharim NPC about building shields...

You are supposed to meet him in a desolated asteroid field but after waiting fifteen minutes nothing happens. The next instant your lights fail and you are knocked unconscious.

You wake up thirty minutes later tied belly-down to a chair with a gag and nipple clams attached. The lighting is poor but out of the shadows you see a very skinny alien-like human walk up to you...

Now,

If you got it right I would have met a progen instead who at the very worst would have taken some of my DNA and then left me alone. But instead, I am wheelchair-bound for 8 weeks...

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I'm just worried you might make a mission where you have to talk to this Sharim NPC about building shields...

You are supposed to meet him in a desolated asteroid field but after waiting fifteen minutes nothing happens. The next instant your lights fail and you are knocked unconscious.

You wake up thirty minutes later tied belly-down to a chair with a gag and nipple clams attached. The lighting is poor but out of the shadows you see a very skinny alien-like human walk up to you...

Now,

If you got it right I would have met a progen instead who at the very worst would have taken some of my DNA and then left me alone. But instead, I am wheelchair-bound for 8 weeks...

Right, because anyone would jump into the creation of a mission or a story without doing some research, I like the logic. Unfortunately, it wouldn't apply to me.

Instead, what you would see are missions regarding topics I already knew whilst I studied the topics I'm not entirely familiar with. I don't rush content. :) You make the assumption that all that knowledge would be put into use in my first mission, besides, I wouldn't send Terrans to learn to build something from a jenquai unless I WAS letting them have Build Reactor for some off the wall reason since to be good at it, they'd need to learn from those who already are.

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