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Misunderstanding w/ Net-7 Staff


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To give a quick background on the complete issue I had with GM Golf today, I need to give a quick synopsis about the entire situation.

I play multiple accounts on 3 different computers, all being mine and registered to me. Perfectly following the Net-7 TOS. The other day, I was switching between accounts/computers and accidentally logged on the same account on two different computers. Two different characters, but the same account. Well, I was pretty shocked that it could even be done and wasn't sure if it were a bug or what. Coincidently Teinbau was in the game talking in General so I told him what had happened. He claimed that he didn't even know it was possible. I asked him if it were a bug or exploit and if it were against the rules and he replied, and I quote, "I'm not worried about it, it doesn't hurt anything." So I took it a step further and asked him if it were a problem that I use the same account, two different toons from the same account, one being my lvl 150 JE to Wormhole my noobie PW around. He said, "not at all, it's fine by me."

So - I am doing exactly that today and went afk for a few min and see that both accounts are offline. I scroll up on my second account and see GM Golf (on his player toon not on his GM toon) telling me to answer his tells.

I respond to his tells and basically tell him exactly about my conversation with Teinbau and he said, "If Teinbau said he didn't know about it, he lied." He also said it was against the Net-7 TOS, which I read after and didn't read anywhere about using the same account, two different toons. It's not an exploit, as I wasn't doing anything out of the game mechanics, simply wormholing my PW around. So, I continued to talk to golf about it and he said, "I really don't feel like discussing it further, if you do it again you won't get any GM support."

So, these are the guys that are Net-7 customer service representatives? The problems I have with the entire situation are this.

1. I thought I could take what Teinbau said for face value and did what he said I could do.

2. When confronted about it, I didn't deny it and when I tried to explain myself, GM Golf, (On his player toon mind you) said what he said, and treated me like a kid.

3. What harm does it cause to do what I was doing? Is it an exploit? It actually is very convenient for alot of players that only have one account/computer to be able to trade stuff around.

So - Again we have to ask ourselves, how is the communication at Net-7 HQ? Who's being honest, who's not?

I've tried to be very optimistic about the game and server, however situations like this make me consider the time and money I invest into this game/community.

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Ok sorry about that last post...I think I just made a booboo. I don't think you are the same person and I was talking about so I removed my post. As far as running more than 1 character on 1 account we do not really want this to happen. We ask that everyone does not do this. Even if Tienbau says that it will not hurt anything we have had problems before with logins on the same account more than once. It is a simple request, make another account.

Thanks,

David

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Ok. So I didn't violate the TOS like GM Golf said I did? And by a simple request, if this issue hadn't came up with me, where would that request be found? I think people should know about it so this situation don't come up again.

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I am really sorry for this but it is not in our current TOS it will be added. Most of the people that have done this have been asked by GM’s to not do this, and have complied. This is an exploit as it was not originally intended to have people login with more than one avatar on an account. It has caused problems in the past and we have always asked that people do not do this.

Thanks,

David

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Thanks David, appreciate you taking the time to deal with this. Sure you have better things to do.

I will not log on two toons from the same account again.

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Thanks :) I don't think the GM you talked with wanted to make it a big deal. I have talked to him about it. Our main concern with this is to make sure people do not get corrupted characters by doing this, it has happen and caused lag on the server.

Thanks,

David

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Not trying to get in the middle of this, or taking sides, but a similar thing happened to me and was pointed to a post by AF_Vet, who at the time was [HGM]. In that post he stated all things concerning Code of Conduct and Terms of Service. He added a couple of things, one of which was that you cant login to two toons in the same account at the same time.

I can no longer find that post, but it may have been the source of [GM] Golf's information.

I believe that it has been replaced by this pinned post in which I do not see that rule.

I do not do this any longer, especially with the chance of having a corrupted toon (or five :) ) nor am I pushing for this.

It would be nice to be clear on the matter, and having it in writing (again) might do just that.

Respectfully,

TooTall

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http://wiki.net-7.org/index.php/Game_Rules_%26_Guidelines

if you read the

FORWARDED ADDENDUM:

A-1. Under NO circumstances shall any player attempt to operate more than one single avatar from an individual account.

A-2. Under NO circumstances shall any player connect more than 3 accounts per individual IP or Domain Name connection.

this was the source of my information.

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The title of your thread and the content don't agree. I don't see where you were "threatened". Being told you won't get support for something that staff have previously said is something that shouldn't be done is hardly a "threat".

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For Golf:

Thanks for forwarding that Golf. I had never seen that before. Based on what David said about it not being in violation of the current TOS, perhaps that was never made official. Glad it's getting added to the TOS, i'd hate to see anyone get in trouble for doing something they thought was ok.

For Jarod:

Thanks Jarod, the information you added to this post was crucial in resolving it. Keep up the good information!

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http://wiki.net-7.org/index.php/Game_Rules_%26_Guidelines

if you read the

FORWARDED ADDENDUM:

A-1. Under NO circumstances shall any player attempt to operate more than one single avatar from an individual account.

A-2. Under NO circumstances shall any player connect more than 3 accounts per individual IP or Domain Name connection.

this was the source of my information.

I respectfully recommend that this be updated into the main body of the TOS at earliest opportunity: I would not think to check the wiki in addition to the TOS as the wiki seems to be a bit of a work in progress, and less of a first-tier resource for the rules of player conduct as the TOS itself is.

Edited by -Seeker-
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For Golf:

Thanks for forwarding that Golf. I had never seen that before. Based on what David said about it not being in violation of the current TOS, perhaps that was never made official. Glad it's getting added to the TOS, i'd hate to see anyone get in trouble for doing something they thought was ok.

For Jarod:

Thanks Jarod, the information you added to this post was crucial in resolving it. Keep up the good information!

I went back and re-read my post to see what could possibly be construed as being attacking you and I don't see it. I'm sorry if that was your interpretation. Honestly if you interpret that as being threatened then I all I can say is you are indeed fortunate in your life, we should all be so Blessed.

Edited by Jarod
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I went back and re-read my post to see what could possibly be construed as being attacking you and I don't see it. I'm sorry if that was your interpretation. Honestly if you interpret that as being threatened then I all I can say is you are indeed fortunate in your life, we should all be so Blessed.

Re-read what trapt posted

For Jarod:

Thanks Jarod, the information you added to this post was crucial in resolving it. Keep up the good information!

Im pretty sure that stands for "thanks for adding your two cents to the conversation that you wernt part of"

;)

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http://wiki.net-7.or..._%26_Guidelines

if you read the

FORWARDED ADDENDUM:

A-1. Under NO circumstances shall any player attempt to operate more than one single avatar from an individual account.

A-2. Under NO circumstances shall any player connect more than 3 accounts per individual IP or Domain Name connection.

this was the source of my information.

Indeed Golf, these are the two things I remember in a forum post by AF_Vet. I also agree with Seeker, below...

I respectfully recommend that this be updated into the main body of the TOS at earliest opportunity: I would not think to check the wiki in addition to the TOS as the wiki seems to be a bit of a work in progress, and less of a first-tier resource for the rules of player conduct as the TOS itself is.

It seems these are important points to be made known, perhaps in a more prominent and un-ignorable place ;)

On a more positive note, I have had a fair share of interaction in, and out of the game with the ENB staff and they have always been fair, helpful and professional at all times.

Thanks for all you help, ;)

TooTall

Edit for grammar

Edited by TooTall
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I respectfully recommend that this be updated into the main body of the TOS at earliest opportunity: I would not think to check the wiki in addition to the TOS as the wiki seems to be a bit of a work in progress, and less of a first-tier resource for the rules of player conduct as the TOS itself is.

We are already in the process of doing so to prevent any confusion on the topic. Thank you for your understanding.

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Re-read what trapt posted

Im pretty sure that stands for "thanks for adding your two cents to the conversation that you wernt part of"

:)

Oh, OK, I didn't realize it was a conversation. I thought it was a post on a public forum for discussion. My bad.

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I probably didn't make myself clear - it was more resignation to people doing this than condoning - I remember saying something like - it's a bug, it shouldn't happen but there's nothing I can do to stop you doing it right now, and thanks for reporting it; I'll try to fix the loophole as soon as possible.

Sorry it's caused problems, but it looks like an honest misunderstanding.

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For the sake of argument, I changed the topic. Looking back, Golf was doing his job, enforcing a rule in good faith. I think the fact that the rule as written is correct, however the placement of that rule is what caused the misunderstanding.

Another thing is - when something like this gets started and people chime in and immediately get off topic and post something that does nothing to resolve the problem, these posts become counter productive and turn into a pissing contest. I don't, nor have I ever posted anything here out of spite or to cause an argument. My intentions were making the community aware of a rule, discussing the rule and making something official for everyone to see. I probably could have handled it a bit different, but you live and learn. Glad it is working itself out though.

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hi guys, I've fixed this bug now,

really sorry it's caused this ruckus - it's really my fault for not thinking the overhauled login system through completely.

I had to overhaul the login system because someone had written a little script which just pinged the SSL system continuously and would hold on to each connection, eventually denying any legitimate logins, and often causing problems in the server or crashing the SSL connection system. I split the login system off from the main server so no matter what shenanigans were put onto the SSL system if it got into a state or was crashed it now just self-terminates and the server starts a new SSL login process within a few seconds.

The server itself is pretty much immune from this type of thing because it uses UDP connections only.

Anyway - the bug is fixed and I'll restart the server after I've finished testing it. Trapt did the right thing for reporting it to me, it's all good now.

TB

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Indeed Golf, these are the two things I remember in a forum post by AF_Vet. I also agree with Seeker, below...

It seems these are important points to be made known, perhaps in a more prominent and un-ignorable place ;)

On a more positive note, I have had a fair share of interaction in, and out of the game with the ENB staff and they have always been fair, helpful and professional at all times.

Thanks for all you help, :D

TooTall

Edit for grammar

I have updated the Code of Conduct with the additional information. Please note that the official code of conduct is pinned over all forums as an announcement and anything you read anywhere else is invalid, unless otherwise noted by the project Board. This referenced material on the wiki was not approved by the Board to be placed here in the forums nor on the wiki. I removed it since it was not supposed to be there.

Thanks,

Kyp

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