Undefined contests have no place in E&B

[Starfox]

also ,

i was there that nite in the FB with 5 groups havin fun when Tasha started the hide and seek contest ... i see nothing wrong with what she did , wow people jump all over her for trying to create some fun in the game ,, really ? wow ...

hats off to you Tasha , keep up the good work...

My hats off to you, someone that actually see's reason

[afrodub]

im sorry i provoked the whole incident with a friendly joke in new player chat.

"hey tasha whens the next gm contest for a hellbore going to be, so i know when to call into work sick"

[Mimir[IS]]

also ,

i was there that nite in the FB with 5 groups havin fun when Tasha started the hide and seek contest ... i see nothing wrong with what she did , wow people jump all over her for trying to create some fun in the game ,, really ? wow ...

hats off to you Tasha , keep up the good work...

I also thought that these events are a good thing, the problem is that the Dev/GM group stated that they were not going to be held unless they all agreed that they were going to be held, and an announcement was made.

Frankly I don't give a crap for a doodah super dooper this or that. Or that Joe Blow got one and I didn't. I just would like to have some little itty bitty bit of consistency from day to day around here.

[VonBon]

I also thought that these events are a good thing, the problem is that the Dev/GM group stated that they were not going to be held unless they all agreed that they were going to be held, and an announcement was made.

Frankly I don't give a crap for a doodah super dooper this or that. Or that Joe Blow got one and I didn't. I just would like to have some little itty bitty bit of consistency from day to day around here.

sure does seem to be a HB issue .. you Terran's are touchie when it comes to ur HB..

i'm sure the Dev's are working on the Station so there can be a raid there in the Future to solve this whole prob..

I'd love to see Kuei working as well as Scooter and Mordana ,

[Heangr]

I say thank you tasha for making the game a little bit more fun (i didnt think making fun more fun was possible but there we go) and also for getting my unstuck in moto...so can we back off now and stop crying about who got a hellbore or not.

Also thank you EMU team for bringing this game back.

[Floss]

Frankly I don't give a crap for a doodah super dooper this or that. Or that Joe Blow got one and I didn't. I just would like to have some little itty bitty bit of consistency from day to day around here.

This. Getting consistency of rules/regulations is just as important as a working game. Asking for consistency isn't the same thing as whining.

"This is BS I didn't get one!" is radically different from "Hey this doesn't seem to agree with the guidelines of the game, can you please clarify the official poition." I haven't seen anyone cry about the item in this thread or the last incident but rather put forward legitimate questions.

A working GM system that follows it's own guidelines is something that should be sorted out and made consistent well before Live. Testing raid content by staff can all be done on the test server without having an impact on the player environment. When the line between the ref and the player gets muddled, problems are going to result.

"It's just a stress test" and "stop crying" posts are really useless for people trying to have an intelligent discussion.

[wolfxsf]

Hey Mimir,

Sorry if I was misunderstood. I am not saying EVERY issue is a whine....not by far. As a former GM I did see alot of legit issues and there still are and will be for awile. I am saying these threads condemning, naming and then chastizing the GM team for trying to add some fun to the game are more whine than productive. Especially irks me when names are dropped to condemn a specific person (aka Tasha). And even more so when a phrase is added to the end of that post about her being just a "bored woman" which IS discriminatory, and a direct violation of TOS.

The whole point of my post is that it is the FEW that come into the forums, start a thread, and then start a flame to condemn someone who is just trying to help the players have fun. As for other issues with statements/threats by the GM in game to players? I wasn't there, have seen no screenshots, and even if I did I would have no comment as that is an issue for the staff to iron out.

"IF" you read my thread carefully you will see I stated that 95% of the players are legit and will have my utmost respect. Most players who have known me over time in the game know I try to help...I have NEVER charged for anything to build or for loot I have given away. "Generally" I am courteous and will work with players than be involved in disputes. I have been known to give tons of loot away freely to players rather than just vendor it. Is that wrong? I don't think so and never had complaints until recently. All the few who do want to complain about rules, contests, and items really do? Ruin the fun for the majority of players who do enjoy it.

Sorry, if the misunderstanding offended you personally. But I do NOT apologize to those who do want to attack, condemn or make comments about the GM's and their attempt to create fun for the players.

WoLfX

P.S. I removed the sig I forgot was still there...and the group by my name must be changed by a forum admin.

Edited March 19, 2010 by WoLfX

[skitszo]

feels like someone didn't get a new shiny....

i was on when this went down... i didn't think anything of it at all.

my je thanks the V-empire for announcing the GoD beams sitting in space for any to go loot from the fishbowl.

[Mimir[IS]]

Thanks for that. And I am sorry I took offense.

I direct you to this closed thread:

https://enb-emulator.com/index.php?/topic/1392-possible-gm-abuse-of-powers/page__st__40__p__10256__hl__contest__fromsearch__1entry10256

and my comment at the time:

Please let’s all keep this in perspective.

I got on at the tail end of this event. Roughly twenty minutes left. Thought to myself “wow if only” if only I had gotten on sooner, if only I was a higher level, if only I had access to unlimited WHs. Then I remembered ST3 (not so long ago) all my running around to get uber equipment, the best PLs, reactor, shields, yes even MLs. But it was all wiped clean in the blink of an eye.

I sit here and watch players fight about KS, and complain about this favor or that favor. As far as I know this is yet another Stress test. We are going to get a wipe sooner or later. So stop the fighting it really is not worth it at this stage of the game…if ever.

So what if some GM holds an impromptu event?

It seems fairer to me if no one knows about it in advance. And if some players get a prize and gain an advantage to kill faster…it is still a stress test, tomorrow we may all be back to level 0.

And if you think about it, it is a great way to have some additional fun in game.

I hope this GM keeps it up through this ST any future tests and well into the live game.

But it was said then by the staff (at that time? and I have seen no change in policy since) that these should not be held.

[irrelevant]

*sigh*

Hey there is nothing notorious going on here people, just some folks being extra touchy because of past events.

There was a contest, some people thought it was poorly executed, most thought nothing of it. Execution of contents needs serious review and guidelines need to be set in stone (e.g. must announce 24 hrs in advance on forums & ingame , or something like that) But that is all, just a review of simple procedure... whats with the drama???

[Ara]

Hey Mimir,

Sorry if I was misunderstood. I am not saying EVERY issue is a whine....not by far. As a former GM I did see alot of legit issues and there still are and will be for awile. I am saying these threads condemning, naming and then chastizing the GM team for trying to add some fun to the game are more whine than productive. Especially irks me when names are dropped to condemn a specific person (aka Tasha). And even more so when a phrase is added to the end of that post about her being just a "bored woman" which IS discriminatory, and a direct violation of TOS.

im really sorry if you see that way just since it was a woman charachter name i called that player a woman ... this forum isnt a role playing one so i belive we can just adress our reply to a person and not to character

to be true i dont care if that man or woman or some kind of AI

if you see the words that way then its only your way of thinking ...

but i dont belive you are that way

prolly just flow over the replys got flammed and replyed the way you did

you posted your opnion what you think about players whinning on forums and not an answer to player replys in this thread

and now abusing me beeing inpolite or even "discriminatory" is kinda cheap

but anyway

Im Really Sorry to anyone that been abused by my word choice!

english isnt my native langue(im sure you got it by now reading my broken english)

i should have choosed "bored person" or to stay in the game world "bored GM"

and wolf there is no point for your "flame" reply's

thats the problem, if a player tell to "Gods" they do something he dont like we get always hit with a stick for it

im now violating "TOS" ..great

[Fast88fox]

After reading the first post a couple of times... It seems to me that the original poster was not whinning but was pointing out that GM kept changing the rules in the middle of the hunt for whatever reason and he threatened players.

Threatening players should NOT be allowed for ANY reason by anyone.

Nowhere do I see that this being a ST should have had any effect relating to a GM threating players.

[Ara]

and yes its really great and good you help players and build for free and such

but again so do i and other players that post in this forum and im alot online

and many know they can always come and ask me for help or info or free builds

so do alot of players

thats all good to know but have nothing to do with this tread or anything

... we all do help or not that wasnt the point here

it seems you dont get along with my posts thats cool ,

my problem was only get treaten just for asking and you proved my point

but let keep the facts and not personal view of things when we talk about TOS or any rules ...

keep up your work and help this game and players im sure everyone of us appreciate it

it was always social and i would love to see it that way

was sitting at work and was bored and yes i was a bored man that shouldnt have replyed to such drama posts

wish you a nice day and dont get angry about such infantile treads

[VonBon]

feels like someone didn't get a new shiny....

i was on when this went down... i didn't think anything of it at all.

my je thanks the V-empire for announcing the GoD beams sitting in space for any to go loot from the fishbowl.

im glad someone got one of those , there was 3 God beams Floating , hard to beleive , but eveyone in there already had one , ( even there alts had one ). lol

it seems the FOTT, AotM and Smit fury drop like candy but Smiter's Wrath is a very rare drop , 2 in the last 6 FB Events during the last week...( another reason for Terran's to be a lil upset ) .

the way i understood it was that the mobs would be more difficult BUT the Loot would be more plentifull , hmmmm...

[fuulishone]

This thread has lost it's way...

The key issues with the contest event were:

1) The rules were changed from game start to award time, probably due to CL50 Terrans whining about lowbies showing up to grab the hellbore. Unfortunately for Tasha as well as those Terrans, the original stated rules were that any could show up and they could do what they wanted with the prize, use it, sell it, give it away. There was no level restriction stated, nor ability to use level 9 missiles required. This changed the game dynamic immensely. Some folks went off and made level 1 Terrans to fly to Earth to find her after she announced she was hiding in Earth. Some folks had switched to their closer alts to save travel time. If the original statement had required ability to use the item, it would have solved things a bit.

2) Somewhere along the way once a ton of folks showed up on Tasha's doorstep, it seemed apparent that she was getting a ton of tells and getting frustrated. At that point she started telling Jenqs and Progens to go away as well as lowbies. There were folks that wouldn't leave, and for good reason since this was an obvious change to the rules that was unannounced. It was at this point that she started threatening players with using GM powers to send them away. Someone on General chat was mouthing off a bit and in response there was a generic statement made by Tasha along the lines of "piss me off and you'll wake up to a level 1 toon". I don't have the chat log, so I don't have the exact wording.

3) Contests that involve a disparity of rewards will always cause drama. It shows a particular lack of common sense/sensitivity to hold a game where the prizes were Hellbore, Asperity of the Master and Reaver, and think that's reasonable. Regardless of how folks want to defend it, Hellbore is not currently available to players and should NEVER be used in any game/contest no matter the justification. It doesn't matter if a GM/Dev looted it themselves. It's just going to cause drama. The AotM and Reaver are fine since they are on the loot tables and currently available to the general public. Perhaps it would've been better to award a mappable bile ml instead of the Hellbore. There wouldn't be the imbalance in terms of rarity/quality of the loot. Or better yet, awards could've been the three tradeable weapons from Blackbeard (Black Streak, Spitter, Caster). At least they would come from the same source and are all equally available or unavailable to the public.

I think GM events are great things. They just need to evolve. Mistakes can be forgiven, but one has to learn from those mistakes and move forward and improve so the next one will be more fun and rewarding, for both the players and the event sponsor. I can't help but feel that Tasha is now going to be shy about running games and for good reason, when all that was needed was just a little bit of planning and common sense prior to the event.

Anyways, sorry for rambling.

[GenghisBob]

First, I love the little impromptu games. I also don't think they should be announced more than an hour in advance, maybe 15 min is enough. All you will get is a lot of whining that "I'm on now but won't be able to at that other time."

However, they should be better thought out and not have an impatient or hurried person running them. Travel is not instantaneous, half an hour is easily needed to get from where you are to where you want to be (except JEs, maybe even them).

Better thought out as in:

1) where to go and hints to use. "I'm not in Antares." is NOT a hint as to where you are. "I can almost smell mountain oysters" is not a hint that you are in Earth sector (at least it made no sense to me even after I knew where they were).

2) Never have a contest where only certain races can win!!! Never, never, never!!! Not even certain races only can receive certain prizes. If someone wins/wants it, then they have a use for it. Maybe learn to build it, give it to an alt or friend or guild mate. It is not the contest managers problem or right to decide.

3) If more than one prize, have a way to KNOW (not guess or change the rules) in what order people finish. Until last night, I wasn't aware that GMs or anyone else could have more than one trade window open at one time. At least that is what it looked like. I opened a window with (the GM) waited about 10 seconds and sent pm that "I'll take the Hellbore". Just as I pressed 'enter', her message popped up that "N*****" has won." I must have been second or third but was 'sent away' because I wasn't Terran. The GM evidently had no way of knowing who open trade windows or in what order (or ignored it). And, no, I don't care that I didn't get the Hellbore. As a JE and PW I couldn't use it. Was going to give to a guild mate to analyze (hopefully - LOL).

4) No unfair hints or player favoritism. At one point the GM said in the special blue text, "Teeteegirl, turn around, come back. You just passed me." I believe it was just because they were getting bored or tired of the contest, but still, this is not a proper hint as to where they were hiding.

I'm sure there are other 'guidelines' that might be helpful, but these are the ones I noticed last night.

But, please, lets have more contests. I love them and join in when I'm online. A small bit of excitement in a game that has little of the storyline, puzzles and mystery of the live game. But that doesn't stop me from logging on everyday. :-)

[siadrinkswater]

Next contest should be loot spawned unannounced in some random part of a random sector IMO... then first person who comes across it tractors it.

that way all the whining directed at a specific GM is avoided and all the disappointment from knowing you lost a contest is gone... instead its like hey cool, just randomly came across a HB lol

[Tenkaris]

im glad someone got one of those , there was 3 God beams Floating , hard to beleive , but eveyone in there already had one , ( even there alts had one ). lol

it seems the FOTT, AotM and Smit fury drop like candy but Smiter's Wrath is a very rare drop , 2 in the last 6 FB Events during the last week...( another reason for Terran's to be a lil upset ) .

the way i understood it was that the mobs would be more difficult BUT the Loot would be more plentifull , hmmmm...

Last pub raid me and Cia did, Smiter's Wrath dropped 3-4 times in two hours, but only 1 FotM

so I dunno

[Tyran]

Make screenshots in the future please

If you didnt screen it, it never happened. And we the community are left in doubt as to your accusations of threats of banning and rule changing.

[Mimir[IS]]

Ummm...

C:\Program Files\EA GAMES\Earth & Beyond\release\chat.log

Chat log located above. Granted it can be modified, but so can a screen shot. But two different logs would just about prove it imo.

[Rezwalker]

my chat log edited to include contest related chat and gripes

NO! my cl 50 TE did not get a HB and dont have a clue how it was decided who got it/them

[Klyde]

I was playing on my PW when the contest was started, and didn't bother joining because the first item I couldn't use on any of my toons. I think it was Whitetrashjd that found her first and got the item.

She then stated she would do it again after a brief afk (to help a player that had asked for a GM). She again hid, and during the course of the next game announced that you didn't have to be able to use the item to win it. I think this is where she went wrong, cause at that point I figured hell, if I can sell it, my wittle pw will be set! So I started looking too. As time went along she attempted to hurry things up by announcing she was in Earth, well she got slammed, when I got to her, she had an easy 20 people around her and more arriving every second. Thats when she stated that only people that could use the item should stay, well others wouldn't leave I guess (because I left and docked) and then ranting started about the rule change mid-game, and it went downhill from there.

I'm not faulting Tasha or any GM here, I think the things they do as volunteers is awesome! The only thing that would make these events run smoother would be staying consistent, as in, start with a set of event rules and stick with them.

I think the little events they hold are awesome, and I really hope they are not stopped in the future!

[Kenu [CDEV]]

There was an event

It gave out high end equipment

Nobody knew it was going to happen

It might not have gone as smoothly as possible

I think it was blue chatted (meaning everyone could see it)

I really don't have a problem with events that give winners high end items as long as it doesn't give out too many of these items.

It was a good thing it wasn't announced on the forums in advance, otherwise the chaos would have been 5x more. Everyone was in the dark about the event so nobody had an advantage.

It could have gone more smoothly and the rules could have been more clear.

It might have been better to announce the event once in blue chat and take it to another channel instead of making everyone listen in.

I think we should take away from this issue that events should be more regulated, but as for what happened here just say "oh well" and move on. I don't see these 3 pages of arguing necessary.

[Tyran]

my chat log edited to include contest related chat and gripes

NO! my cl 50 TE did not get a HB and dont have a clue how it was decided who got it/them

The chat log, exactly what's needed.

The GM had all the right intentions indeed, but the wrong approach.

I think the lesson learned out of this is never to hold these contests again as it's only caused irritation so far

[seekeronos]

I think the lesson learned out of this is never to hold these contests again as it's only caused irritation so far

Oh merciful Buddha, that is about the smartest idea I've red yet on these contests. Save them for the end of the ST like last time.

as an aside: Now that we have a sizeable OL150+ population, why not put Kuei station, controller, and the other über bosses and their loot tables into the game so we can test them out?